Napa winery plays with fire in criticizing fire fighters
April 19, 2010 9:27 am
Dario Sattui
In a reminder as to why many people prefer to remain anonymous in posting comments, particularly those criticizing public servants, a Napa Valley winery has become the target of an intense boycott by local fire fighters–over a Letter to the Editor. [Watch on Sonoma County]
The letter, written by Dario Sattui, owner of V. Sattui Winery, criticized the wage and benefits package of North Bay firefighters. Published in the St. Helena Star, Sattui’s letter argued, “While I respect the work they do and the inherent dangers, they are greatly overpaid, work only two days a week (a third of which they sleep) and get to retire at 50 years old at 90 percent of their pay after working 30 years.”
Reaction was swift to the April 9th letter. The political director for the Santa Rosa fire fighters union spread the word on Facebook and Twitter, resulting in an avalanche of negative comments being posted on the winery’s Facebook page.
The social networks were also used to call for a boycott of the St. Helena winery. One Facebook page supporting a boycott, set up by a Ukiah paramedic, quickly boasted more than 800 fans.
“I only hope that when your winery is burning down, no fire fighters come to help your business,” one post read. “I hope your business rots in hell in this economy.”
A different Facebook page, entitled “V Sattui Wine Tastes Like Raw Sewage” suggested the winery was engaged in “strange labor practices.”
“Public Safety people who want to stay healthy, and their supporters, should probably avoid V. Sattui wines to avoid gagging as they drink,” suggested another post.
Another post, made by the vice-president of the Santa Rosa Police Officers’ Association, featured a photo of the vintner with the caption, “Our hero…should anyone get flagged down by him or see him choking in a restaurant.”
The photo and caption were abruptly taken down.
This wine maker did nothing wrong yet he is being targeted by the unions – public employee unions no less – for speaking the truth about wages and benefits. My late husband always said, “The truth is a defense.” I don’t know why he doesn’t sue for slander the individuals who posted these awful comments.
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Firefighters should work shifts like nurses. Three 12 hr shifts per week. When they are working, they should be WORKING not sleeping, not watching TV, not playing cards. There must be something they can be doing that is productive while waiting for a call to come in. LIVING at the fire station for 48 hrs is ridiculous. Yes, I have great respect for the job that firefighters do, and yes I would be most grateful for them putting out a fire in my home, but that is their JOB. They choose to do it and should be compensated for their time WORKING like the rest of us.
Their treatment of Mr. Sattui for stating his opinion, is reprehensible and absolutely unprofessional. I think I’ll go look for and buy some of his wine!
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Lilylu, That is exactly what I did to show how I feel about the FF and their union boycott. I went on line and purchased some wine from Saturri Winery, I even told them what prompted me to patronize them.
I would say that I hope the citizens of Santa Rosa approach their city council and demand that they hace the city manager call the Police Chief and the Fire Chief on the carpet and tell them to get their employees in line. Two of the main ring leaders were:
Brad Conners , VP of the Santa Rosa Police Officers Association
Tim Aboudaia of the Santa Rosa Fire Department
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lilylu…..firefighters don’t just sit arounf waiting for a fire. My God, educate yourself.
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Getoverit, I know that the fire fighters who are paramedics also go out on emergency calls as first respondents. They don’t usually have to stay long because the ambulance crew shows up and takes over. We know weeks pass without a fire being reported , what is the average of emergency calls that you go out on in a week? My guess is that at least 70% of your time on the payroll is down time.
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Nancy…..I am not a firefighter…my brother is.
This is what kills me….it is so sad that you don’t understand what your fire department does. It really is a shame and I hope someday you and other like you have the opportunitty to find out.
Here we go……when you call 911 in the city of SLO, you will get a SLO City Fire Department crew of 3 or 4 people depending on what station is responding. There will be AT LEAST one paramedic on that crew. They will be at the incident within 4 minutes or less. San Luis Ambulance is a private company who contracts with the city to provide medical aid and transport. The ambulance almost ALWAYS shows up at the scence after the fire department arrives. There are times when the ambulance has taken 15 minutes and this is becuase there are only so many ambulances dedicated to the city of SLO at any given time. Your ambulance could actually be coming from Atascadero if the other ambulances are busy. It happens.
The ambulance crew does not “take over”. The fist paramedic on scence (fire dept. medic) is the one in charge. He stays with his patient and rides in to the hospital in the ambulance to take care of that patient until they are dropped off. The fire truck follows the ambulance to the hospital to pick up the fire medic.
About 80% of the fire departments calls are medical. A medical can consist of a heat attack or an old guy falling out of bed at a convelesent home who needs to be put back in bed because the nurses can do it. SLOFD has some of the very best paramedics you will find.
There are multiple medical calls everyday for each station.
For you to think that all these guys do is sit around and wait for a fire is insulting to me and I don’t even work there.
What can I do to help you understand?
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getoverit, I think that the problem is that you are a true believer, instead of being rational on this issue Before you get all upset, let me explain. You are not addressing the points made, you are instead bringing up other arguments that do not dispute the statements. For example, Nancy stated “My guess is that at least 70% of your time on the payroll is down time.” Now, in your whole statement, you did not once address that point, or dispute it with any facts. The closest you came was “There are multiple medical calls everyday for each station.” Your comment does not state how much time these multiple calls take up on a shift. Many of us have observed firemen on these calls, and the fact is that a lot of time is spent standing around doing very little. And *generally* speaking, riding with a patient is not hard work that justifies the salaries.
When someone is a “true believer,” they support something because of intuition, tradition, or allegiance. For example, you admire your brother and in no way thinks that he doesn’t work hard. No one is suggesting you shouldn’t admire him. And I’m sure it seems like his pay is reasonable. But facts are facts. What you don’t seem to understand is that many of us bust our *ss every day for long hours to earn the money that we do, and we are constantly subject to changes in the market, businesses failing, people not paying their bills, and after everything, we often still have little put aside for retirement. As long as people choose to follow allegiances rather than look at things objectively, then we will continue to spiral downwards until we are flat broke.
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mkaney…..I get your point but I still don’t think you quite get mine. Yes, I am a believer in my brother and the hard work he does. I am not in any way ignorant to the fact that some days and nights the job is easier than others. There is no way 70% of his time is “down time”. When firefighters are on a call, each of them has a specific job. Now wether you think they are doing it or not is your problem because you actually wouldn’t know what that job is becuase you are not a firefighter, paramedic, engineer or a captain.
The don’t just ride with the patient to the hospital (sorry, I should have been more clear)….they ride with thier patient to the hospital to sustain thier LIFE until they are turned over to the doctor at the ER. Their job is to get the patient to the ER alive.
Firefighters jobs are always the same no matter how the market is, no matter how many bussinesses fail or succeed and if people pay thier bills or not. When your business is slow, that doesn’t mean the 911 calls decrease.
The reason I think the pay is reasonable is because of the level of servicethey provide, the skills they posess and the risk of the job. I actually live outside the city limits so I do not even get a paramedic if I were to call 911 because it would be CalFire responding. I would have to wait for the paramedic on the ambulance to arrive which would be several miles away.
It just is disheartening to me when I hear peple talk about these guys like they don’t do anything and just sit around waiting to collect a paycheck. It couldn’t be farther from the truth. Their days at work are filled with training, public education, inspections, station and apparatus maintenance and let’ s not forget all the thousands of dollars they raise on their time off for various charities. They even donate thousands of dollars of thier union dues each year to local kids and families in need. They head up many fundraisers in which they keep NONE of they money.
I understand you work your *ss off everyday at your job. So do I. But so do the firefighters. In your profession I am sure you have had several great years where you were making a lot of money….Kaney Foods right? When the economy turns around in a few years I am sure you will be right back where you were.
If people want to argue wages, fine, we can do that all day. But I can’t stand it when people have such resentment toward firefighters for what they perceive is going on at the firehouse and during calls…it’s a lack of knowledge and understanding of the job and what it entails.
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I agree with Dario Sattui. Not only do they have significant off time, many have a side or second business. Apparently their firefighter salary is not high enough. I will be joining the V. Sattui Winery club to show MY SUPPORT!
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This was sent to me by a radio listener tonight. I post it here merely to demonstrate the passion some folks feel on this issue.
TOP TEN REASONS TO BE A FIREMAN
1. The Pubic Believes the Profession is Inherently “Dangerous” – The fact is, however, some firemen never even see a live fire, but rather cart around senior citizens and illegal immigrants that call 911 for a paramedic. Rather than receiving an ambulance, however, an entire fire truck arrives equipped with the latest gadgets and numerous firemen who stand around and watch the spectacle. Firemen are also not listed on the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics top ten most dangerous professions. Nevertheless, they boast to the public about how dangerous their profession is, and how such justifies their outrageous pay. Ironically, those employees in the top ten are silent concerning the hazards of their profession, notwithstanding their significantly lower pay. Sounds like “hero lobbying.”
http://money.msn.com/content/invest/extra/P63405.asp
2. Only High School Diploma’s Need Apply- Unlike other professions that require years of foregone income and student loans (e.g., professor, dentist, lawyer, doctor, etc.) becoming a firefighter has very generous admission standards only requiring a high school diploma, and the prerequisite young age of 18. See e.g.,
http://www.fire.lacounty.gov/helpwanted/BeAFirefighter_faq.asp#appprocess
3. The Pay that Keeps on Giving – Setting aside the fact that you only work 15 days per month, get paid while you sleep, hang out with your buddies and watch porn at the fire station, the pay is outstanding! When you include overtime pay such is often in excess of $200,000. This is not to mention your generous “defined benefit” plan. Most of us in the private industry do not even know what such is. In fact, their pay has been increasing even in light of the current California budget crisis. But they are heros and therefore they deserve such extravagant pay – what a minute, is that what it takes to be a hero, excessive pay? Some make more than the base pay of the president of the United States! See e.g.,
http://www.dailynews.com/ci_12175241
http://blog.spot.us/2009/07/17/fire-department-overtime-pay-increased-amid-citywide-budget-cuts/
http://articles.latimes.com/1994-01-13/news/mn-11383_1_westminster-fire-department
http://www.fdnntv.com/news.asp_Q_articleID_E_7589_A_title_E_Los_Angeles_Fire_Department_Overtime_Pay_Causing_Controversy
http://www.caltax.org/documents/2003/McGreevy-OvertimeLAFireDepartment10-25-03.pdf
http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/president-obama-2010-complete-return.pdf
4. Don’t Worry About Uncle Sam – Many firemen are completely exempt from social security and medicare taxation because they have their own “qualifying public retirement systems” and “voluntary agreements“ between the state and the social security administration. They may also be exempt from federal and state taxation if they obtain “line-of-duty pay.” How is that for doing your part as an American. Do our soldiers get the same treatment for their line of duty?
http://www.irs.gov/govt/fslg/article/0,,id=111350,00.html
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/golden_fire_exit_Xgr8HobTyGE09gtAHLZLtM
5. Time to Get the Golf Clubs Out – With all of your days off (every month), you will have lots of time for numerous rounds of golf. Case in point, one FDNY firefighter was known for playing 50 rounds of golf in one year. Maybe that is how the disability occurred.
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/golden_fire_exit_Xgr8HobTyGE09gtAHLZLtM
6. Union Protection from Salary from Disclosure – If the salary is justified why do they not want us to know about it? As a member of the union, you can rest assured they will fight the pubic disclosure of your salary and overtime pay all the way to the Supreme Court of California. I thought the public paid their salaries?
http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/data2/californiastatecases/S134253.PDF
7. Claim a “Disability” Enhance your Pension, Retire Early and Get a Second Job – This is the typical path of a firefighter. You claim a “disability” by setting the stage with your dangerous profession/hero status and then you retire early at 50, enhance your pension and find a second job.
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/regional/item_S4lnM5MIw80eNfqXwZqCVJ
http://www.boston.com/news/local/articles/2008/04/17/us_probes_firefighter_disability_abuse/
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/local/Firefighter-who-quit-after-assault-verdict-draws-disability-payments_02_17-39688397.html
http://www.oregonlive.com/news/index.ssf/2009/05/a_former_firefighter_is_suing.html
http://www.allbusiness.com/labor-employment/workers-compensation-workers-disability/13640627-1.html
http://law.justia.com/nebraska/codes/s16index/s1610031000.html
http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1P2-8181709.html
8. Why go to School and Earn Far Less. – Need I say more, notice the average salary for post-secondary teachers (with far more than a high school diploma) who earn on average $58,830. Private ambulance drivers conducing a substantially similar service earn a median wage of $30,000.
http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos066.htm
http://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes533011.htm
9. You are Immune from Budget Cuts – Each time a budget cut occurs in California, “emergency service personnel” are exempt from budget cuts and furloughs. It is your essential status.
10. Good Old Boys Club Membership – If you are a minority and are not part of the circle of nepotism you need not apply, as these magnificent benefits are not leaving the “family business.”
http://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/1993-08-25/news/like-father-like-daughterin-the-phoenix-fire-department-family-ties-go-a-ling-way/
http://www.thedestinlog.com/news/fire-13479-district-nepotism.html
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Impressive posting, someone has done some research ! I think Dave found out what type of “firestorm” you can set off a few weeks back by asking a simple question such as “…..so why do they roll a fire engine on a medical call ?……” I think we found out by the response he ( and his wife ) got, and by Mr. Sattui’s story, that you don’t mess around with firefighters ! They are a very tight brotherhood, deeply rooted in tradition, with a very strong union that is very protective of their jobs and each other. It’s no wonder that when an opening comes up for a firefighter position that people camp out for the job. Maybe when Dave has the local Chief on as a guest he could ask him why they roll a fire truck on a medical call. He could also ask him :
- “Didn’t you already serve in another department and retire ? What is the pension you retired with and what is your current salary as Chief ? ”
- “Why isn’t a fire station staffed with three eight hour shifts like a police station ? Wouldn’t we save a lot of money if we didn’t have to build new fire stations with bunk rooms, day rooms and high end kitchens ? ”
Keep up the good work Cal Coast News……
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GREAT!!!! This is one of the best posts I have seen in a while. Reading the posts from firemen and their benefactors makes you think that firemen think they are the only ones with important or lifesaving jobs. Not the case. They are the ones that scam off their brother firefighters who do work in dangerous areas and who frequently risk their lives. Does any reasonable person feel SLO or NAPA firefighters face the dangers of Long Beach , City of industry or any major U.S. city???? They base their pay on such comparisons when their jobs offer little of the same dangers. When SLO sprinkled the entire downtown we did not reduce the fire department by a single employee, YET the fire danger they are here to defend against was just reduced by 50% or more….. What other group is so pampered that a 50%reduction in responsibility results in no reduction in costs. We have a GREAT fire department, but that does not mean that they are not over compensated. Bringing up that they duplicate the work of ambulance service certainly does not attest to the danger of their jobs. UNFAIR is UNFAIR and fire departments in many cities take total advantage of the citizens they are there to protect.
If this was not so , getting a job with the fire department would not look so much like winning the lottery.
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Dave that was a fantastic post. Clearly their are many true believers out patrolling the media though, I can’t imagine any other reason that someone would have the nerve to vote thumbs down on such a well researched and well documented post, even if they don’t agree. Logic and reason have a tough battle ahead against perception and belief.
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Hey Dave,
Did you just post comments from a guy that is accusing firefighters of watching porn at the fire station?
Wow, I am suprised no one is all over you for slander.
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Dario Sattui is a SJS classmate of mine and was required—after nearly 14 years of construction was almost completed—to spend $1 million to sprinkle the interior of his medieval Tuscan castle “Castello di Amorosa”.
Sattui is a self-made man, working his way through SJS. After earning his masters (How to start a winery without any capital) in business at Cal, Sattui worked in all phases of winemaking before opening up a small cheese shop and picnic ground in St. Helena in the early 1970s.
Thought you’d enjoy reading the comments from this Napa wine blog.
http://tastingroom.blogs.winetravel.com/2010/04/19/sattuis-political-palate/comment-page-1/#comment-17395
Sattui was just down here in March buying grapes from Lucas & Lewelling and Bien Nacido in Santa Ynez Valley…spending the night with one of his wine makers at the Spyglass Inn in Shell Beach and having dinner at the Custom House in Avila.
If you don’t think generous public employee benefits are killing city budgets, you missed the McClatchy Newspapers’ story that ran a week or two ago in the Tribune on Costa Costa County firefighters retiring at 50 with over $200,000 annually.
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SLORat…..Sounds like Mr. Sattui had a nice little va-cay when he came down here…must be nice.
By the way, the Contra Costa County guys retiring at over 200K were cheifs and admin…..not the union firefighters.
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“Where do I sign up to be a firefighter? I can do that job two days a week and run my two wineries on the side. What a deal. I can’t wait.
Dario Sattui, Vintner, St. Helena”
“Thank you for your interest, unfortunately there are no job vacancies at this time. All positions have been filled by the very best and the most dedicated. You may inquire again 9-11-2012.
Tuesday Night Quarterback Fire Department”
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My Dad retired from the fire dept after a long career,my oldest brother also retired after 20 yrs, my next oldest brother just retired after 30 years of service.I can tell you that they all were paid very well and my dad and oldest brother had a second income from side businesses because of the many days off afforded them with the work schedule.
It appears today’s public service employees are mostly different then when my family entered the service.They did not go into it for the money as much as they wanted to serve and provide for their families.I personally know of a local fireman that has a base pay of $115,000 because he is a captain,
he always makes a lot more then his base pay and is a union pushing force .
Its time we here in Cali deal with the unions and over paid public emploees, prison guards, CHP etc.
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Reddog, I am absolutely flabbergasted after reading your post. First why are you and the other FF working 48 hour shifts? That doesn’t even make any sense apart from maybe you guys like having 5 days off a week. Is there any reason why a fire fighter can’t work a 12 hour shift and go to work 5 days a week ? You are telling us that a house fire can last 6 hours or that an emergency call can take up to 3 hours or that occasionally you stay up all night and work for every hour that you are paid for and then you are tired. That is exactly what the rest of us do, we work every hour that we are paid for and then we are tired. You are telling us that you don’t always get enough sleep while your on the job!! Why are you sleeping on the job at all, do you think the private sector 3rd shift workers sleep? Your problem is that you fire fighters are working shifts that should be illegal because you certainly can’t be at your best after 24-36 hours if should not have an opportunity to take a few naps. Yes I’m certain you see carnage on the highway’s and that it is heart wrenching. I don’t mean to be unsympathetic but that is the job that you signed up for. Be happy that you don’t work in an ER because nurses work under that sort of pressure day in and day out, including Holidays and they don’t get a chance to take naps. They sleep at home where they are supposed to sleep and show up for work ready to perform just like the rest of us. If you were working a 12 hour shift you would sound rather ridiculous telling us how hard you have it because you worked 9 of those 12 hours, wouldn’t you? In short, you guys set yourselves up and make it hard, or maybe easy for the most part and then complain when you have a busy night and don’t get paid for enough sleep! Try a 5 day work week.
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I am willing to bet that those officials committed those breaches on tax payers time!
More relevant is the reality that no one from top scale – down in the working class (public or private sector) will be exempt from the pain of recovery.
In the meantime, this would be a great time to screen out the men from the boys and cut off some overhead in those agencies!
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Regardless of Mr. Sattui opinion.
The conduct of those responsible goes beyond being officious, a grave breach of public trust has been committed.
If someone of authority does not investigate and take action against those responsible for this outrage, the public trust will in fact remain unchanged!
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Correction
If someone of authority does not investigate and take action against those responsible for this outrage, the “lost” of public trust or the public fear will in fact remain unchanged!
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I hope this reaches all th e pros and cons out there. Here is a little education for you.
I work a two by four schedule, what that means is, I work 48 hrs on with four days of rotating. If I work Monday, Tuesday, the following week I work Sunday, Monday and so on through out the year. I work three out of seven days a week. That comes to 72 hrs. .
Our Salaries are based on the hours we work in a year and the number of days in a month. In general I work ten days a month but because of short and long months some time Ill work nine and others eleven.
This year my shift worked Christmas Eve and Christmas day and with three sons it can be very heart breaking. When they get mad that I cannot attend holidays or function I have to understand what price they pay as well. Thank God they support me in what I do. I do not work every holiday, next year ill work Christmas Eve but not Christmas day.
I admit, the truth is sometimes I get paid to sleep. And yes we do take an hour for lunch (and sometimes Ill take a quick cat nap). Other times, we get woken up at night, sometimes twice. If I go to bed at ten and get a medical aid call at midnight it takes, three minutes to get up and into the engine, about six minutes to drive to the incident, twenty to sixty minutes on scene, six minutes to return five minutes to use the restroom and get back to bed and finally about twenty minutes to fall back asleep. A structure fire can last up to six hours, I’ve stayed up all night at a meth lab with sheriff deputies waiting for state Haz-mat officers to come and dismantle it. If any of this happens on my first day or night, I still have to work my second day. At any time with in my 48 hour shift, If someone calls we have to go.
But the hardest part of my job is seeing death and carnage. I have to tell myself “The insides are just as natural as the outsides” and “Death is a part of life”. There are names of people I don’t know that I will never forget. The name Jason will always remain with me. He was a young boy, about the age of my son twelve, who was killed in a head on collision by a drunk driver. When we reached the accident scene Jason’s mother was still alive but unconscious in the front passenger seat. Jason was sitting behind her. The large SUV had struck the passenger side of the car killing Jason instantly. The right side of his face had severe traumatic injuries. I had to crawl over Jason and hold his mothers head to protect her neck while the other firefighters were setting up to cut her out of the car with the Jaws of Life. The dash board had smashed both her legs down to the floor. I knew that if she survived she would lose her legs at the knees. But with in minutes I felt her heart stop. The Paramedic at scene decided that due to the mechanism of injury we would not try to revive her. We covered both bodies and waited for the cornier to arrive to allow the CHP to investigate and photograph the scene. Once they were done it was still our job to “disentangle” the bodies from the car and load them into the county van for the trip to the morgue.
Please understand that the danger in our job isn’t only the fires we fight, it’s what’s lost in the fire that can really cause harm to us and our families.
Rene Torres,
Firefighter
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P.S. On behalf of professional fireman, I’d like to apologize for all the unprofessional comments.
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coroner
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Thank You, your broad based apology dignify’s you and your honorable profession. mkaney X2
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Finally, a professional. It is heartening to know that they still exist. Professionals are the ones that deserve the high salaries, and without the unions, you would be the ones who are properly rewarded. The solidarity only holds you back.
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I think it’s important for people to observe the number of comments with regard to this story, and similar stories on other sites. It should be of concern that whenever articles like this are posted, the union trolls come out en masse and take the offense against people critical of public employees, particularly LEOs and firefighters. I have found myself many a time to be the target of these groups as a result of my comments.
If this is the kind of control and politics they practice in these incidents, how does this mentality translate into other areas of their jobs? What does this say about the political messages from these organizations during election periods? The list of things to be concerned about is extensive, and I hope this incident sparks some ongoing skepticism towards these organizations, their tactics, their TESTIMONY IN COURT, and so on…
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Regardless of ones opinion, we each have a right to say what we feel. However, when those words are threatening or could injure another, we do not. For the firefighters and police union president to wish the man dead because he has an opposing opinion shows that they have totally lost touch with their role in society. They are paid well to do a dirty job and to help people. All people…not just the ones that support their salaries. What is also foolish is that support for the public safety salaries and benefits comes from taxes. Should the vintner close his doors because of the mob mentality, the property value will quickly be lowered with a reduction in property taxes and there will be no sales tax generated. So now there is less tax dollars to fund the very group that wants him out of business. That is actually rather disturbing response by the firefighters and gives the community an outstanding reason to develop a salary and benefit limitation initiative for the voters. I am not even suggesting this, but there are consequences when the public loses confidence in those who are paid to protect them. Time for some apologies by the firefighters and get on with life.
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Mr. Deis, you and the rest of the gov’t employees that have these wonderful benefits don’t get any of my sympathy. The unions are the root of many of the problems we face. They are nothing but a bunch of good for nothing, think only of themselves, liberals. I haven’t paid anything into my 401k for two years because I can’t afford it. Why should you and your cronies be any different in these economic times?? Trust me you couldn’t do my job either. You are a no good pos in my eyes for the comments you made. Forget the strike, fire the lot of you and start over.
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standup…..sitdown! When you were funding your 401-k to the max back in the day when times were “good” these “cronies” weren’t getting any extra because everyone else was rollin’.
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When you speak out publicly and criticize people the way this guy did, you have to be ignorant not to expect those people are going to strike back. In his letter, Mr. Sattui also said firefighters work for “get paid for doing nothing for 25-30 years”. Rediculous. These firefighters have every right to not support a business if they want.
I am so sick of spoiled business owners who have been thriving, raking in the dough over the past SEVERAL years (good for you by the way) and now that your business is slowing down and you can’t make your Bentley payment, you come after public safety. When times are good for you, you could care less what thier pensions are. Brats.
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getoverit, There is no excuse for the way the fire fighters responded to Satturi. It was bully tactics hoodlum style. They were attempting to intimidate him and send a message to anyone who had something to say that they don’t like. They ganged up and flexed muscle at the public and that can not be tolerated. They had every right to respond in a letter to the editor and defend their position. That would have been appropriate and professional but that isn’t what they did. The ring leaders should be rounded up and fired on the spot. The muscle belongs to the people that they serve.
By the way, excellent post paperboy.
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Nancy…it would be different if Satturi wrote an eduated letter…he didn’t know what he was talking about. Firefighters don’t just work 2 days a week, they don’t always get to sleep and they don’t all retire at 50, very few do. It was insulting, ignorant and he probably wishes he could take it back. I guarantee you he knows nothing about what goes on during a 24 hour shift at the fire department.
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You and the FD boy’s sure did miss a wonderful opportunity to educate Mr Satturi and the rest of the public. Frankly I really would have expected better from a group of men that I thought were professionals who hang their hats on a reputation of calm professional decorum during critical circumstances. Just look at your some of your posts, “why can he say bad things about the firefighters” , you sound like a school boy. The FD could have turned this into something very positive and had the public eating out of their hand. Whoever came up with the idea to attack Mr Satturi has put all of you in a very light. You and all those in your profession should also be calling for the terminations of the ring leaders who have represented you like a bunch of knee jerk hoodlums. I assure you that public sentiment isn’t going in your direction, no matter how many letters and post the firefighters and their wives write. The public is aware that your union is on a campaign to distort public perception as if the FD behavior can be justified. It can not be.
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Intended to say : “Whoever came up with the idea to attack Mr Satturi has put all of you in a very BAD light.”
Sorry
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“The public is aware that your union is on a campaign to distort public perception as if the FD behavior can be justified. It can not be.”……wow Nancy…..
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Firefighters and police do a tough and absolutely necessary job AND their pay, benefits and especially retirement packages are very good, far and above what the average citizen might ever get or even hope for.
I try real hard not to begrudge what a person makes but when that person’s prosperity comes at my expense and at the expense of taxpayers, I have to pause. Do I want to go broke, to pull more taxes out of my pocket so someone else can get a raise?
Used to be that these types of public servants did these jobs out of a sense of service to their fellow man, a sense of duty to their communities.
But with the way the unions have corrupted the public employees’ thinking, that whole sense of duty as the overriding reason for doing a job has somewhat been lost, replaced by a sense of entitlement.
I blame the unions for corrupting once noble professions. The unions buy off public officials. The unions sponsor and lobby for laws that protect their members’ entitlements (ex.- the requirement for volunteer firemen to be fully trained as if they were full time; the 3% at 50 benefit)).
I agree with Nancy. The city council should haul the fire chief on the carpet and make him tell his minions to knock it off. Then they should launch an investigaition into who sent the Facebook messages that threatened to not put out a fire at the man’s winery and fire them, period.
They may not like criticism. That criticism may be ill informed, but they have absolutely NO business disrespecting the public who pay their salaries.
It used to be in this country, that we could disagree and even defend the other guy’s right to his opinion. But now it seems the norm is to say “shut the hell up you moron” to anyone with whom we disagree.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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Why is it that it’s ok that Mr. Sattui can say bad things about firefighters but firefighters can’t stand up for themselves and say hey, fine, I won’t shop at your store?
The thing with Firefighters is they have to save all kinds of people all the time and you rest assured they would save Mr. Sattui’s butt if he needed it and not think twice.
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Nothing, if that’s what the firefighters said, but that’s NOT what they said!
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Do you think they would still save his life if they weren’t on the clock? I mean COMON that is their job. Yes they do it but lets not forget they aren’t doing it for free either. They are being compensated.
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I can see the fire fighters and their union are patrolling the media today. Bring on the thumbs, we know where it’s coming from. Every red stands for A FIRE FIGHTER WAS HERE.
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“I only hope that when your winery is burning down, no fire fighters come to help your business,” one post read. “I hope your business rots in hell in this economy.”
This is proof that people are becoming more vicious in this bad economy, everyone should take a hit in this economy or maybe just the 13 extra special families getting more and more rich, off the war and the price of gas, medical treatment, etc.
Anybody out there, have a clue as to what I’m talking about?
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Where can I buy Sattui Winery wines?
One man’s fact-laced opinion is small potatoes compared to the damage the firefighters have done to their own reputation by way of their aggressively infantile response.
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V Sattui is in Napa. I have been to the their winery and it is quite nice and very good wine. If you like a white zin I would recommend their strawberry blush I think it is. It is strawbery something for sure.
If you like a port try their Maderia it is good.
It is a rustic winery that goes back many years. I also enjoyed the nice staff. I think that it is unfornate that this is happening.
Oh and you can google them and they do deliver through mail if you are wanting to support but can’t get to Napa.
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OMG, people still drink White Zin?
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Yea people that aren’t wine snobs.
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You can only buy V.Sattui wines online at http://www.vsattui.com
and at the concrete Tuscan castle he spent 14-year building, but was told by the local fire marshall just before completion that he would have to spend $1 million to sprinkle it, even though the concrete is faced with real brick and stone on both sides. “the wooden casks inside might catch on fire” he was told.
http://www.castellodiamorosa.com
is his final latest project that sits on land he was able to buy during the early 1990′s adjacent his 1870′s era victorian.
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Could the message be any more clear?
They are not public servants, they are your masters. Above the law and above questioning. You are expected to pay up and shut up – or you will be openly and gleefully destroyed without shame.
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I hope Roger Freberg is reading this. He chided myself and others on this blog last summer about not stepping up and using our real names. As I stated then as in now, is that I myself am a local business owner and didn’t want any kind of possible fall out from any posting of MY opinion that might affect my business. Do you get it now Roger?? This article is one of the reasons.
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Yes, I do believe that everyone should have the courage of their convictions to place their name on anything they post.
Whether or not I agree with Dario Sattui, I respect his willingness and courage to put his place his John Hancock on his opinions. I can’t help but think what a better nation we’d have with a little upfront honesty.
As for the fire fighters, they have the right to their opinions too, but I think they lost this battle on this by appearing too much like thugs.
As for ‘BeenThereDoneThat”, no I don’t understand… you either have courage or you don’t… apparently, you don’t.
Roger Freberg
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Yea Roger screw my own business? That’s not courage my friend, that would be, being a dumba**. To prove to people I don’t even know that that is courage? If you have to prove something to strangers it sounds like you must be lacking my friend. As for honesty read my posts. I don’t think you will find any lies or malicious slandering in hiding the name. It is just as I stated before. Also I don’t have the luxury have using this site to link my own like you do. Not sure of your intentions either.
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BTDT – Roger doesn’t have a problem using his own name because he gets on this site and kisses the LEO and their crony as*’s. Have you ever seen him do anything different?
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The attack and veiled threats unleashed upon Mr. Dario Sattui, and his Winery are deplorable. I believe that the local citizens should demand that the city council in Napa take immediate action and terminate the Fire Chief unless he brings takes action against the hoodlums that he has placed on the public payroll. I also hope that the local citizenry make their displeasure known by patronizing V. Sattui Winery in a fashion that will triple his average sales. The police and fire fighters take way too many privileges these days and seem to forget who they for.
Speaking of the police, yesterday evening at 5:10 PM I was pulling onto Portolla Road in Atascadero when a SLO County Sheriffs vehicle # 1242 was approaching at a very high rate of speed. He was doing at least 70+ miles per hour, I was going to signal him to slow down but then I figured he was probably on his way to an emergency. Eventually I caught up with him because he way behind a car that was traveling at the speed limit. He never signaled the car to pull over so he could pass, he just traveled behind it for the next two miles and then jumped on the 101. There was obviously no emergency. He was just driving like a bat out of hell because he figured he was above the law. I should have reported him to his watch commander, hopefully I just did.
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Sorry folks, I was irritated and typing fast, I didn’t read my post before I hit the submit comment button. I’ve got some silly simple misspellings in there, just read around them.
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What a lot of people don’t understand is why Firefighters and Police have the retirements that they do.
1. The physical demands of the job are not easy at the age of 20 let alone at 60.
2. The increase in retirement benefits was negotiated in exchange for pay raises.
3. Yes you ONLY work 10 shifts a month. 24 hour shifts, averages 56 hours a week. Most nights you don’t sleep you are up helping those that need you. You spend many of your days off recovering from the lack of sleep from the work day before.
4. If you are injured on the job and become disabled the “Firemen’s Law” prohibits you from suing for damages the person who caused your injury, even if it was an intentional, criminal or negligent act.
How many of you could do the job of a firefighter or police officer? Visit the local station and find out for yourself.
Paul Deis
Morro Bay Fire Department
Retired, Disabled
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Paul Deis
My comment is not a reflection towards your division.
If they had responded this way, the public would not stereotype so negatively.
They’re reactions steer the public in thinking (during a bad economy) not “why” but “how” things may have gotten the way it is or attributed to it.
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Paul, I agree that when there is a fire the demands are strenuous. I was considering other jobs that pay far less and are equally strenuous however those jobs when performed are “generally” not encumbered with the constant threat of imminent danger. When you have to dig trenches it isn’t only strenuous, your also working in a precarious environment. I think most of us recognize that. Like wise when FF is working a 24 hour shift they are often called upon as first respondents to accidents, home injuries, heart attack victims and the whole gamut that encompasses everyday emergencies in the lives of the citizens that they serve. Why you choose to work 24 hour shifts is something that only you can explain, it must work for the FF or they would redesign their schedule so I suspect that more night’s than not, the guys to get to sleep during your shift. Regardless I’m not going to empathize with a justification that you guys are so tired after a shift that you can’t enjoy your time off. Where I’m going with this, is that there is a perceived value of time served vs rate of return i.e. salary and benefits. Sure when you save a life there is no value that can be placed upon that service, but then it is your duty and your job to save that life. I’m talking about service as in the hours that you actually work in a year vs the salary and those killer benefits you receive with an early retirement at 50 and 90% of your salary. I also know just how killer your benefits are because I know a retired prison guard that married an acquaintance of mine. She had two adult children ages 19 and 22. The children are both bums and he put them on his excellent health insurance plan, we tax payers all got foot the bill while the 22 year old worked doctors for pain killers that he would sell on the street. Those kinds of benefits are unheard of in the private sector and completely unaffordable. You guys have it made. The response the North Coast FD delivered to the citizen who made mention of these outstanding benefits is uphauling and I hope he finds a legal way to make an example of the North Coast FD and their bully tactics.
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Cindy…..in order for a firefighter to retire at 50 they would have had to start at 20 years old. FYI, it is incredibly competitive for firefighting jobs and not many 20 year olds get hired.
Also, let’s not forget these guys do NOT get lifetime medical…..as soon as they retire, they pay for it.
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“let’s not forget these guys do NOT get lifetime medical…..as soon as they retire, they pay for it.” I’m surprised to hear that, I assumed that they had at least the same benefits that a prison guard receives! The prison guard that I know retired at 50, he , his new wife and like I said her two adult children were fully covered with a top notch PPO health plan. It cost him out of pocket $5.00 (that’s correct $5.) a month to include them on his county health plan. They had benefits that would easily cost in excessive of $1500.00 a month on a group plan, all paid for by you know who. Well I guess I stand corrected and the FF don’t have it quite as “cushy” as I believed.
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There is a lot of assuming going on…..;-)
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“How many of you could do the job of a firefighter or police officer? Visit the local station and find out for yourself.”
Mr. Deis, You remind me of a sniveling school teacher, they often make the same statements when justifying their salaries and inflated benefits. “How many of you could do my job, just try it, you wouldn’t last a day”. You are working half the hours that the private sector work and earning twice the pay and triple the benefits of the average tax paying citizen. Something is wrong here and I think the word starts with a “U”. It’s time for the citizens to bite the bullet and let you all strike permanently. Your jobs are easy to fill.
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MarkJames….they don’t work “half the hours that the private sector work”…..they work 56 hours a week (straight time). Last time I checked the private sector was 40 hours a week and anything over 40 you get overtime……..am I wrong? They also don’t get to take lunch breaks like the private sector, they eat when they can. They also don’t get Christmas, Easter, Thanksgiving, 4th of July, Memorial Day, Labor Day, Presidents Day, Veteran’s Day or MLK Jr. Day off like you do.
AND they are not allowed to strike.
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Yes, you are wrong. Technically speaking, everyone in both the private and public sector are supposed to get a lunch hour and so on and so on. In REALITY, the only people that get to work 7.5 hour days and have an hour lunch every day are in the public sector. I realize that this may not apply to firefighters, but I can assure you that most of the people I know in the private sector work 50, 60, or even more hours per week… NEVER get to sleep on shift, and always have to take a lunch when they can, if at all. Same reality also applies to the holidays.
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Those are some very interesting numbers which unfortunately don’t add up, Mr. Deis. But I think the bottom line here is that public employees actually perceive the statistics with regard to their jobs in a total and complete vacuum. The fact is that many private sector employees work long hours, have dangerous jobs, and don’t get compensated as much. When it comes to the safety, there is a long list of jobs ahead of firefighters or police on the dangerous jobs list.
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There is an up side to all this.
We got to see they’re true colors.
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