Supreme Court gives public prayer a blessing

May 5, 2014

church stateThe Supreme Court gave limited approval on Monday to public prayers at public board meetings, citing a New York community’s history of religious acknowledgment in the legislature. [CNN]

In a 5-4 ruling, the justices ruled that confined to specific circumstances, faith and government may intersect. Shortly before the high court gave its opinion, the marshal gave a short religious invocation.

This ruling comes less than a month after the Pismo Beach City Council agreed to stop having prayer before meetings and to pay legal fees and damages of about $47,502 to settle a lawsuit filed by the Freedom from Religion Foundation

In the Greece, New York suit, two women objected to invocations at monthly public sessions on government property that were overwhelmingly Christian in nature. The town of about 94,000 residents began allowing prayers to start its meetings in 1999, changing from offering a moment of silence.

The Supreme Court’s conservative majority offered varying interpretations of when such “ceremonial” prayers would be permissible.

Dissenting, Justice Elena Kagan said, “When the citizens of this country approach their government, they do so only as Americans, not as members of one faith or another. And that means that even in a partly legislative body, they should not confront government-sponsored worship that divides them along religious lines.”


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womanwhohasbeenthere

I for one am grateful for this decision. Prayer and religious freedom has been a part of our CULTURE since the very beginning of this country. That is what this decision states. Does anyone remember why the Pilgrims came here? It was fore religious freedom. Perhaps many readers have forgotten about the Inquisition and the burning at the stake of protestants who refused to acknowledge transubstantiation and other Catholic doctrines and were therefore considered only heretics worthy of death?” This was going on throughout Europe well into the 1500s.


The Constitution clearly states “freedom of religion” not “freedom from religion.”


For those of you who would chastise this Court, remember this same court upheld Obamacare.


hijinks

Great history lesson. You leave out the burnings and hangings perpetrated by those Pilgrims against people of other religions because they refused to follow the Puritan orthodoxy. Preventing THAT’s why we have freedom from religion in this country. There’s a thin line between freedom and coercion and persecution. Let’s keep that line clear, and let’s keep religion out of government.


Ted Slanders

womanwhohasbeenthere,


The beginnings of this country were steeped in the laws of the bible, and were followed out by the Puritans to the letter! This is what you propose to hang your hat upon? A short synopsis of the Puritan history will suffice.


If you actually READ the history of America, do not forget about the Puritans along with the Pilgrims! The former faction followed scripture in an ultimately pretentious way that gave their own state and society the exalted status of a New Israel. Old Testament law was DIRECTLY incorporated into their legal systems of New England! The Massachusetts “Body of Liberties” of 1641 stated that “if any man after legal conviction shall have or worship any other god, but the Lord God, he shall be put to death.” (2 Chronicles 15:13)


Death was also prescribed by the biblical Puritans for witchcraft, blasphemy, murder, sodomy, homosexuality, adultery, and kidnapping, of which is ALL supported by the scriptures. As one of many biblical laws followed by the Puritans, were the killing of witches. I am sure you’ve heard of the Salem witchcraft executions? Sure you have.


“You shall not permit a sorceress to live.” (Exodus 22:18)


“A man or a woman who is a medium or a necromancer shall surely be put to death. They shall be stoned with stones; their blood shall be upon them.” (Leviticus 20:17)


The Puritans viewed themselves as God’s special people, and nowhere do the dangers of this assumption became more clear than in the Puritan’s treatment of the Native Americans. Since the Puritans considered themselves God’s chosen people, they concluded that they had the right to take the land from the heathen Indians in the same way the Hebrews of the God of Yahweh, aka, Christian God, were given the land of Canaan.


The American Indians were the “new Canaanites” in America’s Promised Land. Puritan theology was brutal and whose impetus is from the God of the bible being the most horrific serial killer known to man. They saw their mission to convert these “Canaanites” to Christianity; failing that, it was acceptable to slaughter them in the name of Christ.


“All who would not seek the LORD, the God of Israel, were to be put to death, whether small or great, man or woman.” (2 Chronicles 15:13)


READ YOUR HISTORY before you use America’s founding people as an example, that today, if they followed the scriptures, would be placed in prison along with you if you actually followed God’s word!


MaryMalone

Yeah, and don’t forget the Christian Scripture where it says believers are to play in as closet. Those who pray in public are defying Jesus.


MaryMalone

Lol….that’s PRAY in a closet. Gol-durned Kindle.


OnTheOtherHand

I think this is not the first time you’ve blamed Kindle for a typo — or were they Freudian slips?


Slowerfaster

I’ll bet you DO play in a closet !


SHAME on you !


You know what you do, but you can’t hide behind closed doors from GOD !


I’ll pray for your absolvence and forgiveness tonight. SELAH !


GoneBabyGone

And for a moment I actually thought you had some form of education, but after taking a paragraph or two from this post, and a couple from others of yours, I see you are a “cut-and-paste” master!


You are no more ordained by God to preach from His Word, let alone testify to its authority, than any layman atheist out there.


You have copied (with some artful editing) your “prayer given” insights (your self description) from sights like of the James Randi Educational Foundation, the Biblical Discernment Ministries, Angelfire, watchmanatheart and many others!


Your authority, Mr Slanders, is man made. It comes from the lips of others and you have tried to lead all of us to believe you have had direct contact with God to come to your conclusions. Heretic, Blasphemer, Satanists and all the other degrading things you’ve called me and others is nothing more than a smoke screen to hide your own sins.


You have no authority, you have no calling, you are not of God, you are a plagiarizer and nothing more.


But guess what? Ask for forgiveness and it will be given to you, and if so, I’ll rejoice with you in Heaven.


Moderator

“I actually thought you had”

“I see you are”

“You are no more”

“You have copied”

“Your authority”

“you have had”

“you have tried”

“believe you have had”

“your conclusions”

“you’ve called me”

“You have no”

“you have no”

“you are not”

“you are a ”


What part about:” Everyone, less about each other, much less” was not clear?


kettle

womanwhohasbeenthere says: “The Constitution clearly states “freedom of religion” not “freedom from religion.””


No choice for what kind of “religion” either. Bring on the visiting clergy of many colors.


After Supreme Court prayer decision, Satanist offers his own prayer, LA Times


“Let us stand now, unbowed and unfettered by arcane doctrines born of fearful minds in darkened times. Let us embrace the Luciferian impulse to eat of the Tree of Knowledge and dissipate our blissful and comforting delusions of old. Let us demand that individuals be judged for their concrete actions, not their fealty to arbitrary social norms and illusory categorizations. Let us reason our solutions with agnosticism in all things, holding fast only to that which is demonstrably true. Let us stand firm against any and all arbitrary authority that threatens the personal sovereignty of One or All. That which will not bend must break, and that which can be destroyed by truth should never be spared its demise. It is Done. Hail Satan.”


shelworth

How many religions in the US? A few hundred maybe, gonna take a while to get through all those prayers…


MaryMalone

No kidding. Some of the Buddhist prayers are pages and pages long.


Ted Slanders

!!!!! THE SUPREME COURT OVERRULES THE DIRECT WORD OF JESUS THE CHRIST RELATIVE TO HOW TRUE CHRISTIANS ARE TO PRAY !!!!


The Conservative Justices on the Supreme Court are now minions of Satan in this blatant and ignorant decision they made of allowing ANY prayer at public meetings! This foolish GOP faction can hardly be called Christians anymore because their insidious decision is outright blasphemy against Jesus the Christ!


The direct word from Jesus states how the Christian is to pray, to wit: “Whenever you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, because they love to pray while standing in synagogues and on street corners so that people can see them. Truly I say to you, they have their reward. But whenever you pray, go into your room, close the door, and pray to your Father in secret. And your Father, who sees in secret, will reward you” (Matthew 6:5-6)


There’re many different faiths that contradict Christianity, but also pay their taxes to the city of their origin. Within the same vein, then their religious freedom of prayer to their God has to be heard as well! Thank you Surpeme Court, NOT!


Therefore, the conservative dolts on the Supreme Court are legally opening up a can of worms. Case in point, would Christians step outside to a Jewish prayer at the beginning of the council meeting where the Jews deny Jesus as the Son of God, and laugh at this Christian axiom? Would Christianis be comfortable with a Muslim prayer to Allah to start the meetings, of which is the God of the Quran that states within that they’re to KILL Christians and Jews? Would Christians be okay with a member of the Santeria faith in sacrificing a chicken as they do before their prayers? Most importantly, who would clean up the bloody mess afterwards? Do you see where this insidious decision of the ever so ignorant GOP Justices can lead? Sure you do.


The Conservative members of the court have made a great mistake and their moronic decision will be visited once again in the future when the can of worms are opened in the meantime as shown above. Outright blatant fools!


the guy paso

Jesus warned on how not to pray, then why do you continue to bloviate while preaching here in public on a too frequent basis?


Ted Slanders

the guy paso,


To enlighten pseudo-christians like you so you won’t become hypocrites to Jesus’ true words, where in this case, how to pray. With specificity, Jesus says to pray in private. Now, if you’re having a hard time with this biblical axiom, then I suggest that you get another religious belief, because your position herewith is troublesome to not only Jesus, but to Christianity as well!


Isn’t it sad that the ignorant GOP Justices voted directly against Jesus’ direct word in that we’re NOT to pray in public? When will these Republicans ever learn about their belief in Christianity?! Embarrassing to say the least.


OnTheOtherHand

There is a difference between praying and preaching (or even bloviating.) It would seem that the Bible does not say anything against preaching in public, just praying. Right Mr. Slanders?


the guy paso

I believe that “the serman on the mount” was a very public event. I fear that the Rev. Slanders is but a Trojan Horse, you decide what end.


Ted Slanders

OTOH,


You are correct. Examples of this is when Jesus preached the word to enlighten the pagans, and where His most notable preaching event was on the Sermon on the Mount.


BUT, praying on the other hand, is to be done in private as Jesus so stipulates in my treatise above! The old GOP Justices made a big mistake going against the teachings of Jesus the Chris and they will pay a great price on Judgment Day!


MaryMalone

Ted isn’t praying…He’s stating his Bible-based opinions.


Ted Slanders

My dear Sister of Eve, Mary,


I am not proposing my opinions, they are from God’s direct LITERAL inspired words from the bible. The “opinions” that are not biblically backed, and are used out of contexts, are coming from the hell bound Satanic apologetic GoneBabyGone.


ToHellinaHandBasket

I for one wish you would stop the continuance of mocking God and His Word.


Ted Slanders

HellBasket,


Please, for all of us to see, tell me how I am mocking the Hebrew God of the Christians by bringing biblical FACTS to the forefront, and in this case, in how wrong the Conservative Surpreme Court was in their insidious decision to allow prayer in public places? Please, I will await a timely and cogent response. Thank you.


Pelican1

Beware of false prophets….

(Matthew 7:15)


Ted Slanders

Pelican,


I for one are standing at the forefront and stopping the false prophet known to CCN as “GoneBabyGone”, where if it wasn’t for unbiblically backed opinions from this minion of Satan, they would have nothing to say!


GoneBabyGone

Again with Mr. Slanders wanton attempt to burden Christians with more laws we see his vain attempts to try and keep more and more of those who would listen to his controlling rhetoric bound with guilt rather that freed by Grace.


In reality, Jesus was not telling us we should never pray in public; He was attempting to tell people not to be like the hypocrites who’s only desire was to be heard in order to show how religious or reverent they were, and in turn how much more righteous they were. Nothing more, nothing less.


1 Thessalonians 5:17 tells us to “Pray without ceasing.” So, if we are to pray continually, “without ceasing” this means we should pray anytime, including in public, without any fear of what others think or do.


Prayer is about communion with God, about being humble and obedient and is meant to establish and maintain a personal relationship, and accountability, between the believer and God. Where you do it isn’t the point, it’s how you do it and the condition of your heart at the time which is relevant.


Mr. Slanders I’ll leave you with this:


“I desire therefore that the men pray everywhere, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting.” (1 Timothy 2:8)


Ted Slanders

GoneBabyGone,


I don’t burden anyone with new laws because of the biblical FACT that they were there in the first place within the bible!


A heads up upon your erroneous notion that you’re freed by grace, is that you are wrong once again. JESUS SAID: “What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them? Suppose a brother or a sister is without clothes and daily food. If one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and well fed,” but does nothing about their physical needs, what good is it? In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.” (James 2: 14-17)


“And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.” (Revelation 22:12) This “quickly” statement of Jesus’ return is now 2015 years and counting.


You say that Jesus didn’t really mean what He said regarding how to pray? Really? In part, what part of what Jesus stated didn’t you understand? “….. “But whenever you pray, go into your room, close the door, and pray to your Father in secret.” Your apologetics must be really hurting your fingers as you grasp for the proverbial straws in your vain attempt to rewrite the scriptures. Embarrassing to say the least.


Your use of 1 Thessalonians 5:17 that stipulates that one is to “pray without ceasing” was ONLY to be done relative to Jesus’ expected return at any moment as Paul explicitly states in in this passage and other preceding ones. Don’t you feel embarrassed in using this passage as a foundation to your weak attempts in proving Jesus wrong in Matthew 6:5-6?


Your circular reasoning is comical relative to the rest of your diatribe, and does not bear further refutation so as to save yourself from any further embarrassment as you try in vain to rewrite the literal word of God. Unfortunately, you don’t have the ability to understand that your ever so wanting “assumptions” are without equal and are not biblically backed, other than your “personal opinions.”


Therefore, I would be remiss if I didn’t leave you with a passage as well that is so apropos to your ungodly actions, to wit: “For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.” (2 Timothy 4:3)


GoneBabyGone

Your oft used vain accusations of using “circular reasoning” and “apologetics” reminds me of an old saying: “Be watchful when you point the blame at someone else as there are three fingers pointing right back at you”.


By using the Bible to prove the validity of the Bible, as you do and all Christians do, is “circular reasoning” at its very core.


By referring to the “full context of the passage” or by going to other Books and passages in the Bible to prove the passage you are representing is using “apologetics” at its very core.


Embarrassing someone is the works of the flesh, Mr. Slanders. It is based on ego, and the more you try and do so, and not just with me, the more you distance yourself from God.


As I have told you I am not here to embarrass you, no, I’m here to expose you. With this is mind I ask the following:


Your post of 05/04/2014 says, and I quote: “There should be NO DIVISIONS of the faith as there is today, but only one, and the KJV1611 is the only bible needed.”


In light of you obvious reference to the ultimate authority of the authorized King James Version Bible of 1611 why do you quote from the New International Version of 1973? As you did above.


One more please, Mr. Slanders:


Why did you choose to ignore:


“I desire therefore that the men pray everywhere, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting.” (1 Timothy 2:8)


Again, when you point the finger of blame at someone there are ALWAYS three pointing right back at you. Cherry picking, Mr. Slanders, cherry picking.


fishing village

Like in our City ‘a moment of silence’ where people can do their own thing, is the best way to go.


Jorge Estrada

Thank God, anyone’s god or non-god, now we can move on, quit splitting hairs and go to work on the other problems that are scalping our worldly existence.


MaryMalone

BS. We are supposed to have freedom FROM religion, too.


Slowerfaster

This will be fun when adherents of Vodun or Senteria bring their ‘ceremonial’ prayers to public functions.


Who won’t enjoy sticking spears and burning objects into effigies of elected officials or leaders of opposing religious factions ?


Stirring goat guts and beheading chickens to appease gods in order to strike mute or paralyze those infidels and enemies of religious freedom should be most entertaining.


Smoking ganja as a protected religious sacrament will meet with universal approval …certainly here on the Central Coast.


Let the “Free Exercise of Religion” commence !


Ted Slanders

Brother Slowerfaster,


My God, I can see you’ve been in prayer with Jesus the Christ of late, praise you!


ToHellinaHandBasket

The name “Slanders” says it all. You remind me of the fool who used to subscribe to the Tribune under the guise “norske”, and later “norskmann.


The fact that you use the “Slander”, means to “make false and damaging statements about.”


Ted. Stop. Repent.


Ted Slanders

HellBasket, ^^^^^^


You forgot something, and that is addressing my question to you above in relation to your ungodly notion of you not being able to handle biblical facts and how wrong the GOP Justices were in their Satanic decision making today.


Thank you.


Slowerfaster

Brother Ted … I have been blessed with the Holy Spirit in daily communications …as you know.


I call, HE answers ! PRAISE !


Randy Sheila

Why not, taxpayer and public dollars already go support other government-sponsored religious-based activities exclusively. There is no freedom from religion as some of the Founding Fathers might have hoped.


the guy paso

I thought it was freedom “of” religion. Big difference


OnTheOtherHand

Those who wrote about prohibiting “the making of any law respecting an establishment of religion, impeding the free exercise of religion” in the First Amendment to our Constitution did so out of concern that a specific religious group could try to take control of the government and enforce their beliefs upon others who didn’t share them. Many of the original settlers of this country came here to escape that very situation in England.


Thomas Jefferson was one of those who pushed for this language and he expressed elsewhere that he thought there should be “a wall of separation between church and State.” Shortly after WWII, the Supreme Court decided that this was a reasonable interpretation of the First Amendment and that decision has been further refined over the years to include most ways in which government can be seen to endorse a specific religious belief or group of beliefs. This decision seems to put a limit on those interpretations.


While I can tolerate a short prayer which doesn’t get into preaching a specific belief, I agree that this decision opens the door for any type of whacko group to join the action. Why not just say the prayers quietly to oneself in a moment of silence and let others do the same if they wish?


LameCommenter

This decision will displease those who would SCRUB every bit of religious recognition or thought from our country. Bravo, the thin 5-4 conservative majority.


The more sobering point is that if the currency-destroying radical leftist Obama had appointed just one more justice, this would have gone the other, incorrect, freedom-robbing direction. Ditto for many other 5-4 bare USA American majority rulings.


One hopes this somewhat conservative SCOTUS majority can hang on until the extreme left swing of this country’s Senate and White House leaders abates a little. If it ever does.


tomsquawk

Say yes to one, say yes to all.