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Elementary school students suspended for kill list and sexual threats

May 25, 2009

By KAREN VELIE

A group of parents allege Santa Margarita Elementary School officials have failed to provide a safe environment and have chosen to keep their children home until their concerns are addressed.

After numerous complaints, two Santa Margarita Elementary students have been suspended in the past few weeks for threats against other students. A fourth grader was sent home for producing a hit list and a third grader was suspended for making sexually violent threats against his classmates.

CalCoastNews has chosen to leave out the names of the parents and the students involved in the incidents in order to protect the children’s privacy.

More than a handful of parents said their children have been traumatized by a series of incidents that began on May 13. Parents described a student’s graphic sexual threats against other students in his classroom.

Officials and parents claim Principal Melanie Karp has been slow to respond to complaints made by parents and students and has minimized the situation.

School officials are mandated reporters and as such are required by law to report these types of criminal threats and certain suspicions of child abuse immediately, and follow up within 48 hours with a written report, said Child Protective Services Social Worker Desilyn King.

“This all needs to be dealt with for the best interests of all, not just my child,” a parent said voicing her concern for the safety of the aggressor as well as her progeny. “My child hasn’t wanted to go to school.”

Several parents have opted to keep their children home until school officials can assure them their children are being protected. Parents allege Karp has threatened to turn them in for truancy if their children do not return to school.

“Our first and foremost goal is the safety of our students,” said Atascadero Unified School District Superintendent John Rogers. “It is awful to deal with providing the appropriate resources to help the individual student and balance the need for other parents to be assured their child’s safety is foremost.”

Principal Karp was unavailable for comment.

On May 13, the third-grade aggressor was suspended for three days and sent home to a parent who is on the Megan’s Law sex offenders list. Upon his return, he blamed a student for a beating he claims to have received as punishment for the suspension, sources said.

An attempt to find out if a report regarding the alleged beating was filed with Child Protective Services was denied due to privacy issues.

He then threatened to shove items into the complaining students’ rectums and/or vaginas. As a result, Karp assigned the child to a half day in-office suspension before placing him back in the classroom. Due to parent complaints, on May 20, the boy was moved to another classroom comprised of second and third graders.

Parents also voiced concerns that the child’s mother, a registered sex offender known to commit lewd acts against children under 14 years of age, is permitted to attend school functions.

“They recently put a black metal fence around the perimeter of the school to protect our children,” a parent said. “Then they let a sex offender in the front door.”

There is a common misconception that laws prohibit registered sex offenders from encroaching on school grounds. However, according to California code, sex offenders may be allowed on their child’s campus for a variety of reasons. In addition, not all sex offenders are listed on Megan’s list which is primarily for habitual or violent offenders, said a San Luis Obispo County Sheriff deputy.

While at Santa Margarita Elementary School, the boy’s mother is required to register and is then provided an escort while on school grounds, Rogers said.

In addition, on Thursday May 14, school officials discovered a fourth grader’s kill list along with a visual depiction of a student’s demise. Five days elapsed before the mandatory threat assessment protocol was implemented, sources said.

Following parent objections to a lack of concern over the hit list, on May 19, sheriff deputies were called to the school and the boy’s home was searched, sources added.

The child remained in the classroom, shoulder to shoulder with children on his kill list, until he was officially suspended on May 20.

The district has adopted a threat assessment protocol, a flow chart to be implemented by the principal. During the week following the threat, four psychologists did an evaluation to determine if the written warning was a transient or a true threat, Rogers added.

“I can’t comment on what we have done with any one student,” Rogers replied when asked what actions had been taken.

Last year, Karp was sentenced to two days in county jail for driving under the influence. Her blood alcohol was .12, one and a half times the legal limit. She is slated to retire at the end of this school year.

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By: Clemintine on 5/28/09

Wiseguy has gas about the reporter using the term “hit list,” yet on of the bloggers indicates that the Principal herself reffered to it as a “hit list.” If this is the true then it would seem very appropriate to use the language.


If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck it must be a duck right Wiseguy?


You seem awfully critical of the reporter whose doing a pretty good job with this site. Are you one of the disgruntled reporters who keep getting scooped? If so just get out there and start digging.


For those of you who see the great importance of breaking news of public interest and welfare please join me in donating to keep things running.


Good job Cal Coast News.com

By: WiseGuy on 5/28/09

It seems from some of the comments here that some people posting aren’t taking into account that this story deals with TWO problem children, each with different circumstances, different actions, different backgrounds, etc.


Again, I wish to stress that, based on the facts here, using the term “hit list” or “kill list” does not seem to be fair or accurate and serves only sensationalism and inflaming the emotions of readers. I will consider it sloppy and irresponsible, possibly harmful, reporting until any facts suggest otherwise.


Just look at the nature of so many comments here. Look at the wild emotions and accusations. Basic lynch mob mentality.


People need to calm down and get into a reasonable mood and look toward healing the situation. These are children we are talking about, children who grow up in a society where the most awful violent images and anger is practically spoon fed to them through TV, movies, video games. And the adults feed on this too. We are living in a highly dysfunctional, highly violent, terribly angry society. These incidents are a wake up call, not to beat up on people, but to realize how much violence and anger we tolerate and perpetuate ourselves. Simply look at the tone of so many of these comments!


By: Black_Copter_Pilot on 5/28/09

This whole event creates a strong arguement for the vocher system. The private schools don’t have to put up with this behavior, but the puplic schools are riddled with these types of problems.


Either the parents don’rt care or the teachers don’t. Either way, it’s been a losing proposition, the public school system.

By: GrayGranny on 5/28/09

I am terribly concerned about the nonchalant opinions being expressed here regarding the two incidents at Santa Margarita Elementary School (as being mere infractions). I wonder if one of the “posting members” had a child who had been threatened by one of these boys, if his or her stance would be so cavalier.


I am questioning why SMES does not have policies and procedures in place to handle such situations as the sexual and violent threats that were recently made against other SMES students? And if there are protocols in place, what happened, why weren’t they followed? Will Ms. Karp be held accountable for not following established protocols? Families of children who attend SMES should have big concerns if established policies and procedures, such as mandated reporting, were not followed—administrators and teachers must be held responsible.


I know for a fact Ms. Karp enforces truancy policies to the extreme. If only she had been as diligent as a mandated reporter, this very concerning situation could have been handled in an expedient, professional manner.


As mandated reporters, I have to question why the SMES teachers who knew of these two incidents didn’t report them to the appropriate authorities (such as CPS and law enforcement). And as far as Ms. Karp’s DUI, that is between her and the judicial system. All I want her to do is keep our SMES children safe or step aside and let someone take over who has the qualifications to do so.


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By: Maggie on 5/28/09

What I would like to know is why people would say the boy was bullied when there has been no proof. Arriving at personal conclusions based on the uninformed comments here lead me to believe only a handful of people truly know what is going on at SMES. Going by what another blogger said happened is a witch hunt, and it doesn’t matter which side of the issue you stand.


The boy in question, whom I personally know, has SERIOUS mental issues. He’s been in counseling once a week (which btw has been paid for by us taxpayers) for 4 yrs! I have him included in play dates on several occasions. HE is a bully with no parental boudaries! Why the public would take this opportunity to pounce on the victims, the children of the list, and name them as the instigators is beyond me.


I personally know the other kids and while one girl is a known school trouble-maker herself (fighting & suspensions), the other two kids are in the top of their class coming from a very responsible two-parent homes. Knowing this boy, having spent many hours with him, I feel very strongly that this boy should have never been let back in school! I don’t dislike the kid, in fact quite the opposite. But he’s mentally unstable.


Perhaps the reasons are more financial than anything else. The school receives $$ for every child in daily attendance. They also get $500/child/year if the child is on Ritalin. More if they’re on Prozac too. The boy happens to be on both plus! You do the math and it comes down to money. The school would be sad to lose a few students like the ones threatened, but what this one boy brings in for the school alone can make up the monetary absence 2 others.


By: WiseGuy on 5/28/09

Hold on there Ms. Velie! Are you sure you are not being inaccurate (not to mention highly sensational) when you use the terms “hit list” and “kill list”? Both terms suggest there is an intent to murder. Neither of these are necessarily fair or correct terms to use for someone who creates a list of names of people they would prefer to be “dead.”


Many of us might wish that someone was no longer alive, but that in no way means that we have any intent to cause that person’s death.


This boy may have simply been expressing his feelings (perhaps after being tormented), and not any intent to inflict violence.


Do you know otherwise? If not, then those terms are absolutely unfair, inaccurate and inflammatory. It is exactly that kind of continual loose use of the English language that discredits your reporting and this site. And it causes harm to others who are unfairly painted in your stories.


Do you have any idea what kind of damage you may be doing, all for the sake of your selfish journalistic interests?


By: concerned_citizen on 5/28/09

I am shocked at the school boards decision and at the number of people who just want to keep their heads in the sand on this issue. Putting these two kids back in the classroom was a monumental mistake. Mostly for the two of them now, but sadly for many others who will be harmed in the future. These kids need help and that’s what must be provided. Dropping them back in the classroom is just letting the problem fester until it explodes. You are going to be hearing about them again – maybe soon, but maybe not for years to come. Someday you’ll see some terrible disaster in the news and say “gee, that name sounds familiar”. Wouldn’t you really rather take some corrective action now so you won’t have to bear the burden of responsibility for what will occur in the future? You people haven’t even put a bandaid on this problem, much less attempted to identify a cure. Some of you (and that definitely includes you school board members) are shirking your social responsibility and spending way too much time trying to coddle a principal who has been totally incompentent in her handling of this matter. Her inability to deal with this situation alone is grounds for immediate termination. Get off your butts people – your problems will not go away by ignoring them. Your “they’re just kids” attitude is disgusting. You’ve got to fix this NOW.

By: FRACTUREDFAIRIETALES on 5/28/09

to Maggie: I don’t have absolute proof that bullying was involved directly. Sometimes kids will feel left out, snubbed, not included. This is also a form of bullying although this is often a childs way of avoiding confrontation. Is it better to be snubbed than belittled in front of friends? Depends on the child. My opinion only.

By: Maggie on 5/28/09

Fracturedfairietales: I’m still trying to pinpoint the source that reported this as being the outcome of bullying. Do you know where I can find that?

By: FRACTUREDFAIRIETALES on 5/28/09

I am so happy to see that people, whether agreeing with the article, or not are at least talking. Things such as child abuse and inability to cope with bullying are left hidden in the dark corners until we, as adults and parents, can help shine some light on said corners. Children are incapable of making proper choices and need to be guided. That said, those in authority (school officials, parents, grparents, etc.)need to be kept abreast of what their child, student, grandchild is dealing with. I would rather be aware of the problem with my child and deal with it with the proper help, than learn later (possibly after a tragedy) that there were concerns never addressed. That is nothing but heartbreaking for everyone. Mrs. Karp failed to address this in a timely manner, and for that, trust and faith in her ability has been compromised. That is unfortunate, but was well within her ability to control. Hopefully, next year will be a more open and productive year.

By: Maggie on 5/28/09

Cindy: Provider Of The Truth is about half way down this blog.

By: Maggie on 5/28/09

Is there any proof the kids named on the list are bullies? I think whoever started that rumor jumped the gun. Sometimes being smarter, pretty, and even jealous of a person can set someone off, like the kid in question.

By: Scarlet on 5/28/09

Well done, MADD. I’m a very concerned parent involved in this mess and I have no knowledge of DB or RG meeting with Karen. After weeks of trying to work through the system, many of us became increasingly frustrated. This was not something to hush up. That’s been going on for way too long at SMES. A new principal couldn’t arrive a moment too soon. Get help for the kids involved, create transparency so parents can stay informed, and rebuild a culture of trust, respect and safety at the school.


I would say petty mudslinging should be reserved for the schoolyard but that’s not true either. Time to grow up ProviderOfTheTruth.


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By: M.A.D.D. on 5/28/09

To Provider of the truth, KA, yes, I’m speaking to you. How sadly mistaken you also are with the facts. What you say is BS, and those are not anyone’s initials. Both of these issues were not handled in the appropriate time manner. The principal did not make the call to the parent with the child on the hit list until Monday evening at 9:00 P.M. The principal, MK, knew on the previous Friday before school started about this issue. Why such a long wait? Why weren’t the parents called that morning or even that day? You think this has to do with Band or MK’s DUI? Yes, as you see I am also a mother against drunk drivers, Sorry MK. Wrong again. You want to name DB and RG for MK’s problems and issues. I DO KNOW for a fact that DB was not involved in this going to press. You can think as you like but you know nothing. DB is a parent who is protecting her child. As I would expect any normal parent to do in this case. Let your child get a little bit older and let’s see how you might feel. If we are so called casting bottles, let’s make them wine bottles, Mk’s choice, not beer bottles. MK’s drinking issue is not the one at hand. Call it a smear campaign. I call it a lack of many issues not dealt with properly by the principal. You have a lot of nerve getting on here and pointing the finger at two innocent people. I say Kudos to DB for being an awesome parent and doing her job as a parent, and doing it well. As for trying to bring RG into this, shame on you. I applaud RG for getting his child out of SMES before having to put up with this unprofessional take on these issues. You go right on down to that courthouse and look all you want. You’ll be looking a long time. Nobody is worried, only the principal.MK SHOULD just take this lying down as she is the only one who made her bed.

STAY TUNED!!!!!

By: Maggie on 5/28/09

Margaritamom, I’d like to know who you really are. Is your kid on the “dead” list? Has your kid ever been bullied by anyone on that list? Just provide me with your initials and I can figure out who you are, if you don’t want your name in print. You see, my child is in that classroom too.

By: InTheKnow on 5/28/09

The date and ages in the Trib are wrong. This happened in May and the fourth grader is not 9 years old. The fourth grader has many emotional and learning problems and is a bully himself.


Both these children should have been protected. There have been problems on the playground with both children all year including injuries of other children that required medical care.


However, instead of allowing parent volunteers to help supervise Karp has chosen to keep inadequate staff on the yard.


The third grader deserves the help he needs. If it comes out that he has been living for years in an abusive home environment, and Karps lack of following law has been a key factor in his situation continuing, I hope she has to answer for a failure to follow laws enacted to protect all children.


There have been complaints regarding these children since the beginning of the school year. It is not OK to have children threatening rape to kids in first, second, and third grade. How can you call this normal childhook behavior.


Also, Karp always blames others. After her DUI she blamed her size and parents she alleged were out to get her. She never accepted any responsibility for her drunk driving. Now she is again blaming parents.

By: BeenThereDoneThat on 5/28/09

No problem Yelopop. Thanks.


Cindy I read the same thing, page two might I add, and it said the child was deemed not a threat. O.k. I can jive with that. Now how about the other child making the the sexual threats? Anyone heard how that played out?


That all said it still went down the way it should. It was investigated and no weapons found to be accessible to this child but again this would not have been found out (no weapons) if not brought to the attention of the authorities.

By: Cindy on 5/28/09

It turns out that the age of this child who wrote a list of people who he wished were dead is 9 years old, he is also very small for his age. I just read a less sensational and realistic report about it on the front page of the Tribune. Thank God for sanity.

By: yelapop on 5/28/09

Sorry BeenThere. Here’s the fix:

ProviderOfTheTruth and GetReel. Or shall we say CA, MK, DC, etc.? Good for you. You eat your own. If I were Melanie, I would also have my friends/employees posting to deflect any criticism I should rightfully own. Smacks of “Oh, I’m only 90 pounds and had one drink before I mowed down those mailboxes and got that DUI.”


THIS IS ABOUT THE CHILDREN. If you think for one second that this is in any way related to the cut of a music program, you are insane. Well, then again, anyone who claims to have made threats as a child similar to those made by the two boys and says it’s just normal kid talk IS actually insane. God I truly hope you don’t work at the school.


Melanie is looking at a substantial fine and actual jail time. Not because parents contacted a local – and very respected – investigative journalist. But because she broke the law. Three times this year alone. How many more children need to be subjected to this, what, neglect? incompetence? unconcern? before something is done about it. My community and its children deserve better.


And by the way, CCN always references past stories when possible. That DUI close was necessary to show a pattern of bad judgment on the principal’s part. The site would have done its readers a disservice to omit it.

By: BeenThereDoneThat on 5/28/09

Sorry typo on that last was or, not are.


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By: BeenThereDoneThat on 5/28/09

Yelopop. Back off the bong pipe dude or dudet and go back and read posts. I have said the same.


It is about the kids. Relax. BTW, I and my children are in NO WAY associate or have been associated with this school are anyone in it. I am just posting as a parent who follows news.

By: Cindy on 5/28/09

When is the last time a 4th grader hung a classmate on a playground? This has turned into hysteria. The Columbine incident was about “trench coat” teenagers with guns who shot everyone they could. This is a 3rd grader with a list of 3 people who were hurting him. Two bullies and a little girl (he liked) that wouldn’t speak to him. No doubt he thought it was because the other 2 boys were embarrassing him in front of her. The fact that he drew a picture of someone hanging is about as unrealistic a means of actually carrying out a threat as it could get. So what did the police look for when they searched his home, a hang mans noose? Doesn’t sound like he was a big threat to me and I think this child has now been stigmatized for a long time because of this sensationalism. It doesn’t matter if you print his name or not, everyone is going to know who he is. How will he continue on in a local school system or make future friends in this venue now that this has gone public? I would be very surprised to hear that psychologist believe this is a true threat. I suspect the only child who is in danger is the child who wrote it and I’m sure his parents were informed immediately of his hate list and it’s contents. This should have been kept private and the parents allowed to seek private counseling without all this hype. It’s cruel.


The child who made the explicit sexual threats is at risk and a report should have been made to CPS particularly considering his background. Sounds like the ball was dropped where this child’s welfare is concerned.

By: Paso_Guy on 5/28/09

to clem and beenthere


the lead-in was about beastiality and that was my point. the dope and cell phone angles were merely mentioned after getting your attention with the sex with dog info

By: starvingmexican on 5/28/09

So what’s the problem?We’re being fed the bull that “Queer is Dear” on a daily basis.Maybe, you rednecks aren’t sensitive enough.Take an aspirin and go back to the shrink.I have HOPE and know that we will see Change.

By: SomeoneWhoKnows on 5/28/09

Dear Provider Of The Truth,

YOU HAVEN’T GOT A CLUE!


Dear yelapop,

You are very perceptive and bright!

By: getreel on 5/28/09

In addition Been There, considering the truth of the matter, I would sleep just fine knowing that teachers were looking out for my kids. Yes, we must protect our little ones, but what happened here had little to do with that, and much more to do with expose journalism at it’s worst.


I respected CCN, but now I’m not so sure…

By: getreel on 5/28/09

Mark Twain had it right.


WOW…KSBY hope you are happy now…

This could have been handled SOOOOO much differently. Margarita mom, you are spot on. These kids need help. Suspension- appropriate.


Calling a web based news source and complaining. NOT APPROPRIATE AND FEAR MONGERING!


I won’t debase myself and can actually find real words to use without asterisks. The pompousness comes form those who promote hysteria.

The next thing we will see is Hodin from New Times doing a cartoon showing a bunch of perverts lurking in the bushes at SMS.

And what purpose does it serve to mention Karps DUI at the end of the article. Can you say “sensationalism”.

By: margaritamom on 5/27/09

FYI..you want some facts?

1. Death threat was received by principal four days before she called the sheriff or psychologist. Principal broke the law by not acting immediately.

2. Three kids were on this “list”, identified by the principal herself as a “hitlist”. Two of the children have been known to bully, however, the third child has never even made a face at this child or any other for that matter. Not all three were bullies!

3. A picture of a child hanging from noose was also drawn on this page.

4. Other pages in this booklet are the child saying terrible things about himself. He may be a risk to himself as well as others.

I am a very concerned parent who thinks this child needs serious help outside of the school grounds for the rest of the year.


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By: ProviderOfTheTruth on 5/27/09

As Mark Twain said “If you don’t read the newspaper you are uninformed, if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed”. Well ladies and gentlemen – you are misinformed.


The issues with these children have been going on for a while now and the school district has been dealing with it according to the letter of the law. This has nothing to do with the safety of the students. What this is really about is a parent that has a hard-on for the principal because a program at the school was cutback due to budget constraints. This parent has launched a personal campaign to smear the principal.


Why do I think that? Well, a few months ago this same parent stood outside of the school handing out letters about the principals DUI incident. She without drink cast the first beer bottle. To those of you that read the above article, didn’t the last line/paragraph seem a little wierd? Did to me. Where did that come from??? Guess what? It came from that same parent. It appears that she is good friends and next door neighbor with a certain KSBY newscaster who was once a kindergarten teacher at this school. He didn’t seem to like the principal either. Together they have above average access to the local media – did you see KSBY’s coverage today?


This whole thing is over 2 weeks old and now just getting out to the media. Stop and think again about that last paragraph – what does that have do do with hit lists and pre-adolescent “nasty” talk? Remember elementary school? Remember saying “nasty things”? Of course you do!


If my kid were at that school I wouldn’t be overly concerned. In my opinion this is all about DB and RG’s personal vendetta against the principal and today’s over the top political correctness has given them an easy way to cause the principal heartache.


Personally, I’m going to the courthouse tomorrow and looking at the court records of DB and RG for some Geraldo dirt on them. I’m sick of this garbage!!!


Stay tuned.

By: BeenThereDoneThat on 5/27/09

In the post Columbine world, if my kid was on that list I would be concerned also. Would the kid who wrote the list do anything? We won’t know till it happens. People try best they can, being people, to look for possible triggers.


A child to take the time to make a list of people he wants dead is taking an extra step. I like many people have been bullied in past at school and may have not liked a kid and to see something bad befall them but never took the time to write it out. Never had that much contempt.


Let’s hope that your child reel would never have to wind up on some kids list and you have to lay in bed at night and wonder if this is serious or not. Walk a mile in these parents shoes before you act like such a pompous a**.


There is no joke here. Nothing funny. Not even funny to laugh at you.

By: InTheKnow on 5/27/09

To Getreel,

I heard no back pedaling on Congalton. Teachers and child advocates called in to say how important mandated reporting is. The Trib artical is an attempt to catch up. However, they failed to mention the most important aspect of this issue. Is the third grade bully being protected from what appears to be an abusive home environment? The story only mentioned the fourth grader and the suspension for the list. I’ve heard the police have been to the school repeatedly and also both students homes have been searched. Does that mean the police are over reacting?

By: getreel on 5/27/09

This is one big joke.

THIS WAS NO “KILL LIST”!


A Kid writes a note about the kids who had been bullying him that says ‘people I wish were dead”.


Maybe we should call the FBI.


Karen, you backpedaled on Congalton like crazy. Everything was “well, that’s what I heard…”


Maybe we should isolate these kids, better yet let’s just brand them now. School should have done a better job on some of this, but the parents who went to CCN are ridiculous!


Yes, I guess I am “one of those people” that you classify as stupid. So be it. I am not the one on a lame ass witch hunt.


The Trib was much more careful and precise, and has much more intelligent bloggers on this one.


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By: BeenThereDoneThat on 5/27/09

To Granny well put. I like you have no reason to think that parents would have an axe to grind and would make this up. I like you can’t believe a few of the fools on here that see this as no big deal. No wonder the world is getting so messed up. Let’s all just look the other way. Pathitic.

By: BeenThereDoneThat on 5/27/09

Hey Paso Guy buy a clue pal. It wasn’t just beastility. It was also child abuse on tape. I guess for guys like you that are holyier than tho, that, that is no big deal?? Jeez.

By: GrayGranny on 5/27/09

Some of the cynical responses below are shocking to me. Does the 1999 Columbine High School massacre ring any bells out there? Then there was the 2005 Red Lake Senior High School shooting where seven students were killed..there are too many school shootings to write about here.


One of the young targeted victims (and family) are friends of ours and this is not a fabricated story…it is not make believe, it is not funny, it is scary and real. How would everyone be reacting if the threat had turned into action…oh why didn’t anyone see this coming??? I would like to see the parents of Santa Margarita Elementary School students come together and voice their disdain for the SMES principal and the Atascadero Unified School District Board for not providing a safe environment for all children.


Every day we hear about children being sexually molested and the majority of the time, killed. If a third grader has enough knowledge to make sexually violent threats, he has enough knowledge to follow through with the threats. I’m outraged by SMES acceptance of this intolerable behavior.


And let’s not forget SMES now has a Megan’s Law sex offender “hanging out” on the school campus, with or without an escort. As a friend once told me, having a child sex offender around children is like dropping a recovery meth addict off at a meth house.


A “hit list” produced by a fourth grader and a third grader making sexually violent threats…this is not normal third and fourth grade behavior. If you want to downplay this and only call it bullying, that too isn’t okay. Have you ever been bullied? If not, you will never understand the life-long damaging effect this has on an individual.


Threats of violence and sexual assault should not be tolerated anytime, anywhere. Everyone in our community needs to stand up and loudly voice their disapproval of how these two incidents have been handled and downplayed. Maybe it is time for our Governor or Attorney General to get involved in this situation. It seems to me the civil rights of many students have been violated.

By: Clemintine on 5/27/09

Paso guy sarcastacly writes that the beastiality story was cutting edge ….


Don’t you remember that the most significant part of the story was that the suspect was smuggeling narcotics and cell phones into the CMC prison. Isn’t that important enough for you or maybe you just didn’t bother to read the whole story?


North County folks ….geeze!

By: margaritaparent on 5/27/09

getreel…if your child was on this “kill List” would you take it more seriously? It is NOT normal to have a graphic list of people in your class that you want to kill. My son wasn’t on the list but will NOT return to school with this child. I take the life of my child as well as the life of others seriously and am NOT willing to play a game of russian ruelette with them. This is a matter that CAN NOT be swept under the rug just because this is out of character for this child, or becasue the school year is almost over so lets just ride it out. How can you take this lightly….”preposterous”

By: soca on 5/27/09

Cindy – I didn’t catch your mea culpa before I posted my flame. My apologies.


I do, however, want to explore your original comment and would be interested to know your world view. Remember, you read the article, are a thinking adult who has access to the internet and is willing, albeit, as I am, to do so anonymously, and express an opinion on the article.


What motivated you to skip over mitigating facts and move you to opine? You are clearly a person who has the integrity to reason. I am interested in knowing what the motivation was and its construct.

By: Paso_Guy on 5/27/09

that beastiality story is real edge cutting news….the whole county was holding it’s collective breath when that broke!


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By: BeenThereDoneThat on 5/27/09

Yelapop, well said. I was thinking about how everyone gets on CAL. Coast News about their coverage. Of course lets see, they broke things on Hurst Financial before the Trib. and it was called hogwash at first. Same with the Edge story.


I see this morning that the story they reported on about the guy getting arrest for Bestiality in Atas. back on April 15th finally made it’s way to the Trib. this morning. Four+ weeks later.


So I guess that people like Getreal are right. This site and the people on it must have an axe to grind and all this stuff is just made up. Lets ignor this story and wait till the kids do something horrific first. Yea right.

By: yelapop on 5/27/09

No, getreel. Preposterous is school officials doing nothing while knowing this is going on in the classrooms. Preposterous is blaming the media for reporting on a principal’s misdeeds and bad judgment. Typical blame-the-messenger mentality. I’m proud of these parents for finally taking a stand and saying “enough!” If school officials had handled these kids properly and said “enough” long ago, maybe their whole Zero Tolerance/ No Bully Zone crap wouldn’t be such a joke.

By: getreel on 5/27/09

SO…parents call CCN, they print, without all the facts, momentum gains (Due to the sensationalistic content)Fox News picks it up (again content) and viola, we have national news. This is not how media should work. You can pretty much call Karen and say what you want and have a shot at the big time! I can now expect people to call me and ask if my kids are OK going to SM School…

This is great. After many great years at SM school we can than the media for lighting one up on us. Please Karen, share the wealth and look for more sensational topics in other communities as well. I’m sure there are some parents out there who have axes to grind and have a story to tell.

Preposterous…

By: HonestyPlanet on 5/27/09

If Megan’s law serves to protect our children from sexual predators, what kind of idiocy doesn’t extend that protection to the offender’s children??? Are they simply to be doomed by gentics??? (Sorry, we’re going to protect everyone but you from your own sick parent?)

By: karen on 5/27/09

This issue will be discussed on the Dave Congalton Show on Wednesday May 27, at 4 p.m. Tune into 920AM or listen live at 920kvec.com.

By: mccdave on 5/27/09

Santa Margarita isn’t far from Atascadero, so where’s Booty_Juice? If he’s been banned, half my reason for reading this site is gone.

By: InTheKnow on 5/26/09

Now that “Fox News” has determined this is a national news story, do you think the rest of the local media will think this is a newsworthy story and report on it?

By: alittlebirdtoldme on 5/26/09

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,522040,00.html

By: BeenThereDoneThat on 5/26/09

Sad part is, is that your molestors, rapists, killers etc. didn’t become that all of a sudden as adults. It is started early on, in these formative years and to make matters worse, is to find the normal childhood stuff, (I will kill you if you take that) from the abnormal stuff (let me write down how I will kill you).


The home life here says we are already leaning to abnormal. This could be societies problem person of tomorrow. Time will tell.

By: FRACTUREDFAIRIETALES on 5/26/09

All it takes is one more taunt, one more push on the playground, one more mean word and someone finally pulls a Columbine. Many families have guns in the home, whether for hunting, etc. It is not that hard to find one, pack it in a backpack and produce it at school. Don’t think that it hasn’t happened, it won’t happen or can’t. If you believe that, you perpetuate the belief that because we are a small community, we are safe. Mental illness strikes everywhere. Some people become stronger when pushed, others break. Help these children (and obviously the parents) NOW to learn coping skills, before it becomes a tragedy.

By: Cindy on 5/26/09

Soca- Lighten up, you ask “how can you equate an adult woman who has been convicted of having sex with a child under the age of 14 with a 20 year old having sex with a mature 17 year old?”

I didn’t equate it. I didn’t pick up on the fact that Megan’s Law is different from other sex offenders. I thought they all get lumped together and that we don’t really know who did what since it’s all under Megan’s Law. Initially I was responding with ignorance. Next time I’ll read more closely.


You state: “Finally – You seem fine about calling this hit list a hate list.”

I “thought” we were dealing with an 8 year old, who in turn was dealing with other 8 year olds. When I was in third grade I was 8 years old the entire school year. I don’t believe 8 year olds make hit lists, plan them out and then kill. Now I find that this child is older than 8 (2-3 years is a big difference at that age) and this child has been “bullied mercilessly”. Different scenario.


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By: soca on 5/26/09

Cindy – First – how can you equate an adult woman who has been convicted of having sex with a child under the age of 14 with a 20 year old having sex with a mature 17 year old? Would you have the same point of view if this was a man with the same convication I wonder?


Second – How does an 8-9 Y.O kid know about sticking objects into another’s vagina or anus? Hmmm? Books, TV, Movies? Maybe just a very sick homelife under the guardianship of a convicted child molester.


If you are wondering why a social services agency would allow this mother to raise her children if they were concerned about her, then you know little about the way child welfare services works, their level of supervision and the paradigm under which they operate, which is to to follow the SS “Golden Rule” – Keep Family Units Together At ALL Costs.


Finally – You seem fine about calling this hit list a hate list. But I suspect you would be an anonymous poster (albeit under a new pseudonym) who would be castigating the school district for not taking action after a killing spree, when they did have direct prior evidence of a threat – nee Columbine. While kids typically can be quite cruel to each other, it is a rare one who will take it beyond playground taunting and put it down in writing. Methinks that this one is a ringer and will be a part of the criminal justice system in the future.

By: Cindy on 5/26/09

Yes OK Yelapop,

I deleted my post, your not the only person who let me know how wrong I had it.

I didn’t know that a Megan’s Law conviction is reported on a separate list from other sex offender types. It’s beyond my comprehension that CPS would leave a child with a parent who is convicted of LEWD OR LASCIVIOUS ACTS WITH CHILD UNDER 14 YEARS. When I think of a woman and mother with that sort of a conviction it floors me.

What’s really scary is that we know that this is a disease/defect (whatever you want to call it)that can’t be treated so why leave a child in that kind of danger? Up surd.

P.S. I didn’t say that Karp had “one drink” I said one drink “too many”. I’ve since been told that she does that frequently so I’ll just drop it.I hope these children get the help they need and deserve. Hopefully its not too late to save them.

By: JorgeEstrada on 5/26/09

Our children are like a small tree. If they get topped or harshly treated their growth is stunted and if they get injured they may die.


Protect our young forest.

By: yelapop on 5/26/09

Cindy, why the hell does the age being 8 or 10 years matter? Children were threatened and the parents want the principal to DO SOMETHING. And we do know the facts about the mother. Check Megan’s Law” 288(a) LEWD OR LASCIVIOUS ACTS WITH CHILD UNDER 14 YEARS. So there goes your college coed theory. And about Melanie Karp having one drink and getting popped at 1 1/2times the legal limit – you really know how to stretch it. How about a little compassion for the children involved and less apologizing for an apathetic administration.

By: InTheKnow on 5/26/09

To Cindy, from what I’ve heard they are 10-12 year olds, they are not 8 year olds. the psychologist did not interview the boy until he was OUT of school, before that it was not reported. The word is that the kill list was a credible threat, not a transient threat. If this child had gone ahead with his threat, where would we be now?

But I think what is missing here is that these children are seriously in need of help.

One boy is being raised by a child molestor and is displaying behaviour that makes you think he may be being molested, the other child is writing a kill list of ones that bully him and seems in dire need of some counseling and perhaps rescuing.

By: Clemintine on 5/26/09

Something that some of you might have missed here is the child’s relationship with the parent, who is registered as a sex offender.


In view of the child’s behavior I hope that law enforcement and child protection services conduct a preliminary invetigation to determine if the child’s current behavior is driven by the parent as well as the child’s suitability to remain with the parent.


Hopefully this child can be steered down a more appropriate path.


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By: Cindy on 5/26/09

If I’m not mistaking the principal said that she had these notes and “hit list” reviewed by 4 separate psychologists and it sounds like they made an assessment that didn’t require dismissing these children. We are talking about 8 year olds. Get a grip, it doesn’t mean anything to the child saying it. Do you remember when you were 8 years old? Did you ever say you wanted to kill someone? “I’ll shoot you (was very popular)”. Remember things like “If you break that I’ll kill you”? Siblings tell each other their going to kill each other frequently (and they are often a lot older than 8)

Granted I don’t recall ever seeing it put in writing which indicates that a bit more thought was put into the words. These are still little 8 year olds. They don’t mean it. The supposed “hit list” is laughable. Its a list of kids the child doesn’t like today but will like again tomorrow. I can’t believe the police actually searched this 8 year olds place of residence. For what, his gun? No wonder children act so crazy these days. The adults act crazy.

The child who made the explicit sexual threats IMO is a different story. He does sound like he’s been abused or possibly simply not supervised as to what he watches on TV or reads we don’t know however I think we would all agree that this child needs intervention and help until this gets figured out. This sounds like a child to be worried for/about.

By: hotdog on 5/26/09

Jeez, I’m not a parent but its hard to imagine some parents being so out of touch with what their kids are thinking and doing. Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young admonished us to “teach our children well” about 35 years ago. I’ve wondered about that ever since-it’s very fashionable to dress like an idiot (emulating gang attire), much of the music is full of hate and violence, guns in schools-and all this at ever lower ages. Now here, in cute little Santa Margarita, we have 8 year olds doing this stuff! And the staff is slow to act. Amazing.

I somehow feel if I were principal I would call in the parents AND the cops immediately, and crush this sort of miserable behavior. Our kids should be learning and playing, not having to deal with this stress. Only by love, instant feedback and reasonable consequences will our children learn how to deal with life’s issues. By displaying confused and dysfunctional behavior themselves, the ‘adults’ often set a very poor example for our young. Bad scene…

By: anotherconcernedmom on 5/26/09

My child goes to this school and last year we went through a similar experience, a note was past from the student to my child’s best friend that read, she/he wanted to kill the two of them. I first talked to the teacher who did nothing and wouldn’t, so I went to the principal who said she would talk to the child. My husband and I talked and then I called her back and told her if she didn’t call the sheriff we would,(3rd graders do know right from wrong) We were very disappointed that it wasn’t handled like any bigger deal then chewing gum. We did put our foot down before the school finally did their thing and we also kept our kid out of school until it got handled and the sheriff came, but of course the student never did miss any school because of this. These things are a huge deal and at this age we need the school to make a bigger

deal of things like this and make a positive impact on some troubled kids and or their families. They could be saving a life in a couple of years if they just REACT, does our principal remember the word explosion? Would she handle it the same way if a child wrote that they wanted to KILL her or something else? I’m sad to hear that the same problems are happening this year with these things, because there are a lot of positive at this school too and a lot of great parents. My heart goes out to these parents, it’s a scary thing to not feel that your child is safe at school in little Santa Margarita.


By: Altair on 5/25/09

http://www.oncefallen.com/CriminalizingTeenSex.html


Children as young as pre-school students have faced severe penalties for “inappropriate sexual behaviors.” The Virginia Department of Education reported in 2007, 255 elementary students were suspended for offensive sexual touching; the Maryland Department of Education reported 166 elementary students were suspended for sexual harassment. These suspensions add a permanent mark on the child’s school records. In our quest to prevent sexual violence, we are willing to place marks of infamy on children as young as four in the name of public safety, proclaiming the ironic mantra, “If it saves just one child, then the law is worth it.” Tell me, are we willing to destroy the lives of many children to save “just one child?”

By: Bluebird on 5/25/09

My question is who supervises the principal and does her evaluations? The woman is going to retire in a year. If all of this is not reflected in her personnel file she can apply for positions in other school districts. Is the fact that she had drunk driving charge in her record. As I recall she was in total denial about having an alcohol problem.

She has failed to protect her students and it appears she has broken the law by not reporting timely. The two boys she suspended appear to have serious behavior problems that will not be helped by suspension. The 3rd grader has all the signs of having been sexually abused himself and he said he was beaten because the principal suspended him.

Action, not hand wringing by the school district is required.

By: BeenThereDoneThat on 5/25/09

I say it sounds like time for an investigation by the state. Don’t leave it to the county. They are up to their own you know what’s, in all their own B.S. they create.


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