Brown tosses tax plan to voters

December 6, 2011

Gov. Jerry Brown

The governor wants you to approve a new, $7 billion tax package “to get the state back on track.”

In an “open letter” emailed Monday to Californians, Gov. Jerry Brown said he has filed an initiative to place on the 2012 ballot a measure asking voters to approve dedicated funding to “protect education and public safety.” Signatures of registered voters now will be solicited to qualify the plan.

Brown noted that conflicts with Republican state lawmakers have prevented him from dealing with California’s current $26.6 billion budget deficit with a legislatively-approved ballot measure. Brown said he doesn’t know how people would have voted, “but we will never know. The Republicans refused to provide the four votes needed to put this measure to the people.”

Deep budget cuts, which Brown said Democrats “reluctantly” approved, “came at a huge cost. Schools have been hurt and state funding for our universities has been reduced by 25 percent. Support for the elderly and the disabled has fallen to where it was in 1983.  Our courts suffered debilitating reductions.”

Brown’s plan proposes a temporary tax increase on the wealthy, a “modest and temporary increase” in the sales tax, and guarantees that the new revenues be spent only on education and public safety.

Millionaires and high-income earners will pay up to two percent higher income taxes for five years.

“No family making less than $500,000 a year will see their income taxes rise. In fact, fewer than two percent of California taxpayers will be affected by this increase,” Brown said.

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Why pay more taxes into a system that is broken? Fix the system – then ask me for more taxes.

You can’t fix a system over night. He’s working on it. Did you see the other article regarding cutting back on pensions? Did you open the link in the article where it talks about how many govt. employees have been cut? Although the system can’t be fixed overnight, the state needs more funding now.

Fix the broken system and then lay off 50% of the public union employees.

Anyone ever go down to get a building permit? How about a business license? Or how about a liqour license? Or just a simple marriage certificate? Really want to get mad, drop by the DMV and try and get out in less than an hour…

There you go again,,get those evil union employees. I’m starting to get a kick out of how much you people ablsoulty have so much hate for unions. It’s just so over the top.

Yes, I’ve gotten building permits, what’s your point? I have a business licence, what’s your point? I’ve never had a liquor license but so what? What’s wrong with getting a marriage certificate, that’s a new one? I haven’t heard the right complaining about that one yet. You’re right re. the DMV, they’ve been cut to bare bones. Let’s raise the taxes on the wealthy and then they can hire new employees so you don’t have to wait so long. Actually, I’ve gone in quite a bit lately and although there have been long lines at the DMV they were quite organized, I was quite surprised how well it was run. The last time I taken care of with in a half hour and I’ve never waited over an hour.

Yes, a lot of teens make appointments for their driving permits and licenses, I’ve just never needed to. I walk in sit a few minutes and I’m out. Yes they have their busy times but over all I feel that they get a bad rap.

Point I was making is, cut the fat and streamline the bloated processes we are funding with our tax dollars.

And I have nothing against union members personally, I have quite a few friends who are in unions.

I do have a problem with unfunded union pensions and benefits as well as some of the ourageous salaries we pay public servants, prevailing wage for any public project (even the smallest ones) and I have the biggest problem with wasteful and unaccountable management & admin which over sees and spends our money…

Yahoo! That’s my guy!

Governor Brown has already taken the appropriate step in asking the legislature to bring it to the voters. As usual, the legislature could do nothing but allow a stalemate to develop, blocking ANY action on what should be the voters’ choice.

Governor Brown has now decided to use his power to do the right thing: take to the voters an important issue that the legislature could not resolve.

I applaud Governor Borwn for not following Obama’s “lead” and wasting time and resources trying to plead and wheedle with the legislative house of the state government to give the California voters a say in where their taxpayer dollars are spent. The morons Republican voters elect to government are useless for anything else than playing the role of a bloated, lavishly funded door-stop—one that has stopped any measure that holds them accountable for their actions in the legislature, or that gives Californians a voice in funding issues.

The reason I voted for Jerry Brown is because I am old enough to remember all of his prior terms in office in California, and note that our state did very, very well under his firm lead. He didn’t waste time prettily posturing, or pounding his chest and acting like the pre-simian Republican clowns in office now. He is creative in his solutions, he is not afraid to use his power to get them done and, overall, the people he has governed have greatly benefited with him as a leader.

As is typical in our dysfunctional government, in both state and federal bodies, the Republicans have blocked every measure that will give the people relief and help us through this recession-depression. Taxpayers have been forced to watch the Republicans block measures that will preserve the public education necessary to keep our state a viable power in the future, and have no venue to address it.

The voters should be brought into the discussion at this point. The Republicans are desperately attempting to stop referring this issue TO THE PEOPLE to decide because they realize this will be a referendum on their own time- and resource-wasting actions in the legislature. The Republicans also know they stand a very good risk of losing big-time in the 2012 elections, because Californians have had enough with their bull****.

California voters want to have a voice in the decisions of our government, This is something the Republicans have blocked for years now, and our state has suffered because of it.

I don’t like everything Governor Brown advocates, but then I don’t expect to. I do, however, realize that he has, throughout all of his time in office in California, benefited our state with his leadership.

When given a choice between allowing the California State legislature to continue to vote for their lobbyists and, time after time, drive our government to a stalemate–and Governor Brown’s plan to let the California voters decide the priorities for our limited state funds–I’m with Governor Brown 100% of the way.

Ditto ditto ditto, good post Mary.

You, too, Typo. I have the impression Brown has not done much while in office. I would like you to name one thing, one DOCUMENTABLE bill which he proposed and which actually passed, that reduces California’s debt. I’ll follow up on it, if you can point me in the right direction.

That’s your impression because that’s what you want to believe. Browns been working hard to cut back.

I don’t believe that governors (or presidents) propose bills, bills are presented to the gov. and then it’s up to the governer to pass or reject the bill. I’m sure if I’m wrong that someone will correct me. I cannot ever remember a gov or a prez presenting themselves with a bill for them to sign. I still remember the old School House Rock when that guy sang about this.

I’m going to provide a few links that show many,,not all of the actions that he’s taken to cut waste and to cute spending. But does it really matter to you? Of course not, like all the other right wingers, IF you even read the links it still won’t matter. Like Obama, if they stopped world hunger and created world peace and cured cancer you would still say that they don’t do anything. But oh well, here goes:

This is an interesting story on the topic of this news story here at CCN:

It didn’t take long for Brown to start cutting govt. waste:

I see the ultra lib Typoqueen is at it again in this one. “Pay their fair share”. What does that mean exactly? Are the rich (over 500k) supposed to pay taxes at a rate that makes them take home the same as someone making 50k? That would be socialism at its best. The rich already pay a higher percentage to taxes. You want to be fair woman? Tax everyone at the same rate and don’t give any deductions and tax credits to the complete idiots who have 30 kids and can’t afford to pee. I get so sick of people that can’t see that our government wastes so much money already on the poor decisions of the poor. I have a friend that got laid off two years ago and sucked unemployment for almost two years until he tried to find a decent job. Well, too late and he had to take a low paying crap job and now he complains. Where was the effort early on? Deadbeats don’t go far in my book, nor do public employee unions that fleece us on a daily basis. Until Jerry tells the prison guard union to take a cut, he can kiss my ass.

Great post…

I find it ironic that those who condemned the last governor (because of his political party )yet praise this new (actually just a rerun of the same old one) governor, who can’t seem to get the job done either.

The problem is two fold and is decades old, governement is too big, entitlements are too free and bloated salaries or benefits for all government workers are far too out of control.

Not one thing has been done to curb the spend side of the equation, yet every new leader wants to raise taxes or enforce new fees on the already strapped taxpaye to pay for this continued insanity… I think it was Einstein that said doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different outcome is insanity…

Jerry Brown is no primping, ego-laden pretty boy like Schwarzenegger.

He has a long history of leading California, as governor and major of Oakland, to economic stability and prosperity. Our state flourished under his first term as governor.

Schwarzenegger destroyed our economy, just as the Bush administration destroyed our national economy.

Fortunately, Jerry Brown is now the governor following Schwarzenegger, so our state has a chance.

Not so good for the nation, however. Obama is as much of a neocon as Dick Cheney ever hoped to be. Obama has actually worsened the economic status of our country.

No mary, governor mnbm is a lifer politico who comes from a family of lifer politicos, who have been part and parcel of the ruination of the once great state of California.

And that is not a defense of the actor tried politician, it is fact.

The roots of these problems can be found in history books and the public record of legislative agendas and politicians.

The age of runaway entitlements and boondoggle pensions has to end. A triming of the waistline of all government is what is needed not another tax or fee…

Name one law he voted for which actually passed that positively affects California’s debt, Mary….I will research it on…..

It shouldn’t take you long. But I provided a few that he passed.


1. Typoqueen is not “ultra lib.” She is, IMO, quite moderate in her views, and often is the voice of reason on the board. I know she is not an “ultra lib” because I am an old-school liberal. If you think she is an “ultra lib,” you’d wet your pants if you ever met a REAL “ultra lib.”

2. Governor Brown’s actions are to GIVE THE PEOPLE A VOICE on an important funding issue in California: Do we sacrifice the future of our state in order to meet the massive budget deficit developed under Republican Governor Schwarzenegger? Or do we look to those who can best afford a very small increase in their state taxes to ensure California’s next generations will have the kind of brilliance we need to keep us a competitive world economic force?

That’s all. It’s giving the voters A CHOICE.

Governor Brown already took the necessary steps, going to the legislature first to get them to give the voters a choice.

The Republcians in our state legislature, as usual, brought the issue to a stalemate.

Governor Brown is not a simpering pretty-boy tool like Arnold Schwarzenegger was as governor.

Gvernor Brown will compromise, but when it is important he will do what needs to be done to accomplish it.

He has filed to bring to the California voters the issue of our state’s future.

What is your problem with allowing the people of California to finally have a say in the course of our future?

If you don’t like it, you don’t think ANYBODY should have a chance to vote their own choice?

Vote against it, if that is your choice. But to whine about other Californians having a choice is wrong and, indeed, it is exactly like the pack of Republican monkeys in our state legislature.

There are certain issues that I have ultra liberal opinions about, but there are some that I’m fairly con. about. So I guess you’re pretty much right about me.

As far as the rest of your post, thank you for bringing levity to this issue. I also got strayed once again from the real story here. What is wrong with bringing something forward for the public to vote on? This seems like what a democracy is supposed to do. I would think that even those that oppose what Brown wants to do wouldn’t mind bringing this to a vote. To think that they call us commies and socialists,,

I also wanted to agree with your first post about Brown. I also remember when he was our gov. many moons ago. He was a very good and effective gov.. I’ve mentioned this before but that never stops me from being redundant. I would never visit, shop, or even drive through Oakland in the past. It was a scary place. It still has it’s issues with crime in certain areas but he did an amazing job in turning Oakland around. Many people thought he was crazy to take on such a huge job. Now when I go to SF I always stay in Oakland. They have a beautiful Marriott in their downtown city square and the entire area is absolutely beautiful. The streets are nice and safe. The art deco buildings have all been refurbished and the shopping is pretty good. Brown brought more industry to Oakland and helped the economy of that city. We also stay there because there’s a Bart station right in front of the Hotel so we can hop on the Bart and go under the Bay to SF, very easy. But 30 years ago you couldn’t stay in Oakland, it was a dirty filthy mess and the crime was incredible. Although they still have a high crime rate, there are safe areas now and there never used to be.

Brown was also a very good Attorney General. He knows the law and he’s fair. Brown makes the libs mad and he makes the cons mad, I would vote for Brown for Prez in a heartbeat. He’s not afraid to make bold moves to do the right thing, that’s what we need from a prez and that’s one of Obama’s main downfalls IMO.

Standup, you should “standdown” on this topic!

Subjectively, you should get your house in order before you rail against Miss typoqueen! False analogies, failures to state, and child like fallacies are your game of the week, huh?

Regarding the “fair share” issue upon the “wealthier”, the tax system is MORE FAVORABLE to them than the middle class. The CBO reported in October that “after-tax” income has grown enormously faster for the richest of the rich than it has for any other group over the past few decades. This issue is exacerbated by The Economic Growth and Tax Relief Reconciliation Act of 2001, Jobs and Growth Tax Relief Reconciliation Act of 2003 (Phase II of the Bush tax cuts), and the Tax Increase Prevention and Reconciliation Act of 2005. These entities above are known as the Bush Tax Cuts.

Regarding your entertaining, but contrary to fact assertion of “the rich over 500k are supposed to pay taxes at a rate that makes them take home the same as someone making 50k? That would be socialism at its best” is quite funny! You went to the extreme to try in vain to prove your point which does not bode well in in trying to prove your point! Get it?

Then you follow your “stacked deck” statement by being ignorant in saying; “that would be socialism at it’s best” Huh? No, it is NOT socialism that you’re referring too, but an extreme form of Communism. Socialist governments have free market economies and wage differences, but higher taxation for public services such as healthcare, education, roads, etc. Wait, this premise has a familiar ring to it! :)

Relating to the poor making bad decisions, I somewhat agree with your premise, but if one is a TRUE Christian, of which you’re obviously NOT, then no matter what, we’re to take care of them nonetheless. Jesus said; “If anyone has material possessions and sees his brother in need but has no pity on him, how can the love of God be in him? Dear children, let us not love with words or tongue but with actions and in truth.” (1 John 3:17-18)

Your statement of “public employee unions that fleece us on a daily basis” is quite empty to say the least, without giving us some meaningful examples. Do you have any that are worthwhile?

Furthermore, prison guards should take a pay cut? Really? I ask you, then why aren’t you a prison guard? Obviously you can see where I am going with this, yes?

Sorry Teddy BOY, my house is in order. I used an extreme example to get my point across, but if you want it in a preschool format so you can understand, I don’t have the time to provide that. You obviously got the point. As far as your holier than though views, there are too many people on this earth for long term survival of the human species yet many keep breeding like rabbits because of their belief or sheer stupidity in reading the condom label that says to put it on before sex. If you want to support all these extra children, do it on your own part. Why am I not a prison guard? Well for one, I have a college degree from that school in SLO called Cal Poly. For two, our prison system in California is so corrupt that we have the highest incarceration rate in the world. Do you really think that California has more bad people than other countries. Did you know that the US has more people incarcerated than China and China’s population is how many times greater than ours. Blame the wonderful lobbies that work for the correctional officer’s union to push for harder laws to punish more people to build more prisons to put more guards to work. I am sorry but 100k a year to watch over some bad guy is fleecing of the taxpayers. If you don’t agree, I don’t give a shit.

“Did you know that the US has more people incarcerated than China and China’s population is how many times greater than ours. Blame the wonderful lobbies that work for the correctional officer’s union to push for harder laws to punish more people to build more prisons to put more guards to work.”

Bonk! Wrong answer. You are half right. We do have more prisoners than China and more non violent offenders. But the reason is due to conservative lobbyists. The Koch bros started this lobbying group with bunch of other fat cat right wingers. Through their group (ALEC) they managed to have the laws changed through lobbying during the Reagen admin so they could start opening privately run prisons. So those fat cats now own a few prisons. Then came the the the three strikes law,,,oh yeah that was a law written up and and they lobbied by ALEC along with a few other laws so they could get more non violent offenders tossed in their prisons. The largest private prison is in AZ, the senator in where that prison is is also a member of ALEC (can’t remember his name). Guess what other law ALEC managed to write up and lobby our corrupt politicians for? They are now allowed to make the prisoners work for 23 cents an hour. Those Kock bros are making a fortune by having prisoners in private prisons make our military supplies. Ever single military helmet is made by slave labor in private prisons at 23 cents an hour. I wonder how much those fat cats make in profit by selling that stuff to the govt.. I have really looked into this and have done a lot reading on the subject. It’s a disgrace and needs to be exposed. So anyway, don’t try and blame everything on unions, this has nothing to do with unions. You should try working in a job where you get poo an pee thrown at you, perhaps you might have a little more respect for that job.

Wow, we can finally agree on something. Yes, the private prisons are a major problem. Their owners I’m sure pay big money to lobby. However, look at any law enforcement union especially in Calif. and you will see a paid hired gun up in Sacto.


WOW, with your continued ignorance upon Socialism, of which you didn’t address for obvious reasons to save face, and not being able to address the “fair share” issue, and you have the audacity to say you went to Cal Poly?! Surely you jest, right? I would suggest that you try and get your parents money back post haste because your schooling was all for naught!

I understand, it’s a given, YOU’RE NOT A CHRISTIAN because of your stance upon the poor having extra children that goes directly against the Judeo-Christian bible. “Be fruitful and multiply” (Genesis 1:28) With your type of rhetoric upon this issue, you’re probably a hell bound Atheist!

Certain jobs, that no one else wants to do, are usually paid in higher income, get it? Sure you do because you allegedly have a Cal Poly education, remember? You know, like Garbage Collectors, Plumbers, that did out your toilet because you over ate at Taco Bell the night before, and PRISON GUARDS! Surely you’ve seen their plight on those “Lock Up” shows, yes? Certain positions require higher wages to attract individuals to those positions! 2+2=4!

Anyway, you’ve shown your colors to this forum in hiding the fact that your alleged Cal Poly education goes severely wanting because you’re all about throwing your opinions out there, but fail to follow them up with FACTS. I’ve read your posts, and you are who you pretend to be.

Wow Ted you really want to play. Socialism/Communism hate them both so wtf. If you knew anything, you would know that socialism is the first step towards communism. FACT And if I were you, I would keep my parents out of this asshole. I supported my own way through poly so don’t start assuming things that you don’t f-ing know about.FACT And so, you don’t think any one would be a prison guard for 2/3 of their current wage? You would have a line out the fucking door. FACT And if you can’t see that the world is over-populated given your bible thumping “be fruitful and multiply” statement, you are a complete idiot. FACT Do you really think that Jesus would want us to multiply to the point of starvation and over-population? He wouldn’t. FACT Go back and collect your garbage loser.

Do you eat with that potty mouth? Take a valium, light up a doobie, do something to make yourself calm down. I’m picturing you foaming at the mouth with your eyes bulging, it’s not a pretty sight. This is just a news and discussion forum, no need for such anger, it’s not worth getting medical problems over.

Standup ol’ buddy, shhhhh. Like Typo alluded too, sometimes you have to accept your limitations upon your ever so wanting knowledge, and not take it out in front of everyone, okay? Didn’t they teach you this concept in your Psych classes at Cal Poly?

If you hate Socialism, then we can only assume that you’re not going to collect SOCIAL SECURITY when you become eligible, yes? You’re not going to be able to call the cops either, especially with your attitude getting you in trouble, since they are paid through socialist ways! Do you have a private Fire Department that you can call? Because the one we have in town is driven by SOCIALIST pay!!! Oh, oh, now what?

Oh, since you said Socialism leads to Communism, and the USA has had socialist entities since the beginning, just when do you propose it turning Communist? Have any idea? Yes?

Assuming that your assumed education was paid for by your parents, was just in jest and presented in a comedic way, but it did hit a raw nerve, didn’t it? Are you sure you’re telling us the truth? :)

Okay, I’ll let you and your child like potty mouth get back to friends so you can spew forth other misguided notions to your equally dumbfounded friends.

Good day.

Unbelievable ! What a bunch of misleading bumpkus.

Here’s the reality:

For Californian’s that make more in icome than $48,029 a year, the income tax is $2,114.62 plus 9.3 % any income above $48, 029. This does not factor in any deductions.

For someone making more than $500,000 a year ( Where Brown’s surtax begins ) , they would pay $44,147.92 in income taxes, without deductions at the 9.3% rate

At the 11.3 % rate , an income of $500,000 would mean a tax of $53,187.34 without deductions …leaving a still princely sum of $446,812.67 to put in the bank: roughly TEN TIMES the total income of your false $50K a year bogeyman counterpart. .

Standup, you need to go sit in the corner with that cone hat on your head. ..


You have a problem, you’re dealing with facts! I checked your figures, and they’re correct. It is far better for the “standups” of this world to make up their own facts to substantiate their otherwise weak arguments! Therefore in their own minds, they’re always correct when they use this ruse. There lies the rub. :(

Ted, I know a fact. The fact is you are a poor loser.

I’m with you on this point, standup. Slashing benefits to the unemployed who can’t find work, the sick who have worked and paid into the system, and the elderly who want to die at home, should not be the first cuts to make. Cutting unlimited overtime and “sick day pay” to workers who take advantage of the system–especially the prison guard union–is the way to go.

Moving funds from agencies that either mismanage their funds or apply them in ways that do more harm than good–and I am thinking of local entities like the “psych unit” at General Hospital which has literally orchestrated so many assaults on patients–these agencies do nothing for us.

Cutting salaries in half for bureaucrats at the top, who do not generate as much income as they make, is another way to go. The average pay for a lawyer in public service is about four grand a month. The average pay for a court clerk that files your paperwork is more than that. What education is required for that job? A high school degree.

The “poor” are “poor” because they are paid the lowest wages for the most physically demanding work. They are “poor” because they pay your mortgage for you, when they pay you rent. You know, and I know, that if you own your own home, every dollar you make that does not go into the government benefits you will use when you retire, goes back into your own private property. When the “poor” work, every cent goes back into your wealth, not theirs.

The one issue which is legitimate, in my opinion, is the freedom to have as many children as you want–or your religious upbringing influences you to have. The solution to that is to provide birth control and education about birth control in high school. You can’t be “pro-life” on the one hand, and not expect to be paying for it with the other.

I have to admit, I am lost in the blizzard of California politics and World Politics, and the contradictory information I get when I go to one of these “money converter” Web sites where you can compare the American dollar to that of other countries.

While California is whining about how broke it is, the dollar appears to be holding its own. And lets face it, California has more wealth than any other state. So, why is everyone broke?

For all the complaints about Obama, it was Obama that sunk money into California–seven per cent –of that 700 BILLION dollars that he spread over 50 states to keep their local governments solvent. Only problem is that, in exchange for California getting so much more than almost all the other states, California was supposed to tighten its belt come 2011-2013.

That California got seven percent of the ARRA money meant that California got more than its fair share of bail out funds from the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act.

In fact, 57 BILLION DOLLARS got paid into California’s Educational system, which is about 87% of the state’s General Fund. And that money did not just come from “the middle class,” or “the rich.” It came from the little guy, as well because who do you think is paying rent on your mortgaged second homes and rental units?

Poor people pay higher premiums for insurance because they can’t afford to pay annually or semiannually, so they pay monthly and they pay more money per month for that privilege. They are poor because they are often taken advantage of, for example, by owners and employers who cheat and don’t actually pay their half of workman’s comp, and who don’t pay the full amount of the withholding tax that they take out of workers’ paychecks.

Some people have jobs because they have screwed their better educated, or better skilled co-workers out of their jobs. Instead, the boss gave the job to his relative, girlfriend, boyfriend, in-law, or anyone less likely to compete for his job.

A certain percentage of unemployed means you can still work. A lot of unemployed people are ready and willing to work, but God forbid a job in California should go to someone from some place else.

It’s almost as if California is suffering from the delusion that it is not part of the United States. Get real.

You’re being floated by the Federal funding you get to take care of your elderly and your medical bills–and this includes supplimenting your own insurance when it doesn’t cover the whole bill. The poor who are ticketed up the cazoo for driving old cars, or being homeless and thus “loiterers” or “drunk in public” are paying for your public safety and your court services.

They are thus paying to repair your roads, and your “infrastructure” after an earthquake, flood, fire, tsunami, windstorm, sandstorm, or riot by you know who. It’s not like you’ve split off from the rest of the piecrust and gone floating off towards Fiji. Not yet, at any rate.

Your problem is, your state has to get a hold on how much it pays its bureaucratic deadbeats, such as bureaucrats who make hundreds of thousands of dollars in overtime and perks when they are not worth the money that is spent on them.

Not all agencies are worthy of such disrespectful aspersions. But I can think of a couple of state and county agencies who definitely fit the M.O.

The Employment Development Department is not one of those agencies. Social Services is not one of those agencies.

Your local Public Health Dept.? Now that could use a little work.

Your Administrative Office of the Courts? They could use a little belt tightening.

The union in charge of the buses that run through the Five Cities area? A few of those supervisors “should walk the plank.” Riding some of those buses is like paying two bucks to be verbally abused by the bus driver. (Sorry, Will, but it had to be said. Trust me….from one NY’er to another….)

It’s overpaying for supplies, poor accounting and management practices, taking expensive trips to confrences just so you can get a paid vacation.

It’s tooling up the coast in your gas-guzzling monster trucks while the “poor” get blown to bits in countries with their infrastructure bombed into oblivion.

You want more money? Take the bus, if you can actually catch one in San Luis Obispo. Taking two hours to get 15 miles between Grover Beach and the County Govt. Center doesn’t help you get to work. And the $12 MILLION dollars that LAFCO got for public transportation did not–miraculously–result in more bus routes. So quityerbitching! Okay?! Try making work NOT A CRIME in this state! Now, there’s a thought!

Geez….I shouldn’t blog on an empty stomach…..

oto: Regarding fed bailout funds, you need to recalculate.

California has 11% of the country’s population, and only received 7%. As usual, CA got screwed.

Exactly. California, New York, Connecticut and other “liberal” states are the perennial funders of the “welfare” states like Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi, Missouri, and other midwestern states.

These states have consistently sent more tax dollars to the feds than we received back in goods and services from the feds.

The “welfare” states, on the other hand, have sent in far less tax dollars to the feds than they received back in federal funds and services.

Indeed, these “welfare” states would not be able to wipe feed their own people if it wasn’t for California and the other successful, more liberal states.

So here’s an idea: get the Republican-controlled House to refund to California ALL of the excess they have paid over the years. Then we can pay off the deficit, fund a decent education system, start taking care of our own poor and needy again (instead of taking care of the “welfare” states poor and needy), and get our state back on track.

California also gets approximately 90% of all Federal Defense contracts and dollars, last time I checked. The Dept. of Defense Web site ought to provide an update on the stats.

Good points otto.

I too am lost and dumbfounded when it comes to making sense of taxes and governemnt spending of those taxes.

Just take those ARRA dollars you mention for example, that federal money which was borrowed by our federal branch of government, who then gave the money to the state government to spend.

Next take for example thecurrent highway construction being done on HWY 101 (which is already one year over the completion date) and that ARRA money is being spent on state workers (Caltrans, who is supposed to administer the project)and some union sub contractors (the ones who along with Caltrans have not completed the job on time). The amount of taxes and fees on fuel we buy as well as the taxes and fees our DMV take in was supposed to be spent on highway and bridge infratsructure, but of course we all know it is not. Then take into account the management and admionistration by Caltrans of all the state highways and roads in this state, which they have not maintained or managed properly over the last two decades.

Now tell me where any of that makes sense?

Next how about the Dept of Education which is always crying about not having enough money and how those poor teachers are going to be laid offand how those poor students will be forced to be eductaed in crumbling and leaking school rooms if we do not approve their latest bond measure (each and every election year). Yet CA has some of the highest per student dollars spent of the 50 states. Why is it that we have a federal Dept of Education and a state Dept of Education as well as a superintendent of eachthe individual school districts, yet they never have enough money, ever? And as you say there is $57 billion being funneled into the school system here in CA. Every person in this state who owns a home, pays school fees whether they have any children or not. Every extra curricular program or project my kids participate in is fully funded by me and the other parents.

I could go one about each of the other government agencies we have running the show(or not), but my point is taxing the people more for the same things is not good snse, good sense would be proper management and oversight of the tax money we all pay already…

Cut the waste, entitlements and ridiculous government salaries or benefits first before even thinking or new taxes…


Your points are well-taken and informative. I know the DOT is a big player and a big spender of state and Federal dollars, as is the Dept. of Ed. I was floored when I did some research into how much money goes into education. After two years of studying the layers of bureaucracy and the myriad funding streams and laws governing how the money is spent, I barely scratched the surface.

But I finally realized that California’s Dept. of Ed. is not the “bad guy.” It’s job is limited. It is designated as the lead agency that receives federal funds and then distributes it as the LOCAL state entities decide. The local agencies decide what to spend the money on.

So, I called the Dept. of Ed, and spent a few dozen hours schmoozing my way to the accounting techies who actually distributed the funds to the various counties and school districts.

I asked the Dept. of Ed accountants how they could keep track of, or know, that the money allocated was actually being spent as intended? The answer was, “We really can’t know. Once the money leaves us, we can only assume that the money is being spent as (the particular statute) intended. We leave it up to the local education area agencies to spend the money properly.

So, again, the money must be tracked and audited at the local level. For anyone willing to put in the hours, days and weeks needed to track these local funds, the CDE (Ca. Dept. of Ed.) Web site provides the most detailed methods it has to do this, including its own accounting software. But it is huge and vast. I literally had to move furniture to make room for the research.

Another great post oto…

“I asked the Dept. of Ed accountants how they could keep track of, or know, that the money allocated was actually being spent as intended? The answer was, “We really can’t know. Once the money leaves us, we can only assume that the money is being spent as (the particular statute) intended. We leave it up to the local education area agencies to spend the money properly”

This speaks volumes about the sate and federal system and how dysfunctional it really is.

I am sure if you looked into any state or federal agency you would find similar behavior.

So the question I always ask is, if this were a private business or corporation do you think heads would roll for the funny book keeping or would there be greater accountability?

Yes, public monies neede to be audited and tracked carefully and those agencies who take our tax dollars need to be held accounatble as well as all public employees…

Of course the public employee unions will cry foul and descrimination for any scrutiny.

“The problem with socialism is that you eventually

run out of other people’s money.”


“Socialism” …. BOO!!! Did that word scare you, huh?

Hopefully SOCIAL Security doesn’t run out of funding before you qualify and could get those monthly checks!

Please, Ted. Hand azuresees a coupon for Depends before you scare it like that.

Well Mary, that DEPENDS if asuresees now sees the error of their ways in the future not to make quotes like that, when in fact, they will benefit going against said quote! What’s new? :(

Cute, but uninformed and shmarmy.

racket wrote: “Someone subsidized me.

And I don’t think it was the 38% who don’t pay anything.”

You’re right, that would be me, and the rest of that shrinking population formerly known as the middle class. This is exactly what you guys are doing, by forcing us, the middle class to pay for you we are sinking, we are becoming those ‘filers’ those that live below the poverty line and like you they don’t pay taxes. But if you have it your way then those below the poverty line will also pay for you, do you not have any feelings of guilt over that? I’m not down there yet, I’m still paying for you so I guess you’re okay but is sure sucks for me. Obviously if the wealthy aren’t paying the feds and those below the poverty level aren’t paying, that only leaves the shrinking middle class. And you see nothing wrong with that. My new nick name for you is Marie Antoinette….what ever happened to that chick??…oh yeah the whole head thing.

Typo, I am not sure I understand.

Are you, as the filer in your household, paying $2500 per dependent in California income taxes?

If you are paying more than that, you are subsidizing someone else (me in this example).

If you are paying less than that, you are being subsized by someone else.

Your post does not make it clear which one it is. You complain about being poor, and you complain about subsidizing me. The point I was trying to make below, and will reiterate here, is that you cannot be both.

My exact ‘filing’ is personal, NYOB. But I never said that I was poor, I feel poor as I can’t save any money. All of my money goes out to bills and for the most part those would be medical bills. I would now be considered middle class. I’ve been it all though, I’ve been fairly well off and I’ve been poor. At this point that’s all relative. When I was well off I paid a lot of taxes, I was well of way back when those that did well paid taxes,,the story of my life, wrong time to be wealthy eh. I pay lots of taxes again only this time it’s to support people that make more than me. I have not said anything different than that.

“I feel poor as I can’t save any money. All of my money goes out to bills and for the most part those would be medical bills.”

Typo if you are generating enough income to meet the $2,500 tax threshold for each household member then you are earning a very high income. I would say you need to stop purchasing expensive items girl. What are you and your husband driving, a 2011 Lexus and a 2011 Mercedes? As for your medical bills, you are allowed to write off the portion that exceeds 7.5% of your adjusted gross income so if your medical bills are that high, you should be paying considerably lower taxes! WOW- You must have one heck of a huge adjusted gross income even after all your medical tax write offs to be subsidizing the rest of us!

Something here doesn’t make sense????? You can’t have it both ways.


I don’t agree with you, Cindy. I also think it is none of your business what anybody here decides to spend their money on.

I’d like to know what you think are “luxuries.”

No Typo, it would not be you or me who subsidized racket. Unless you paid state income taxes that total $2500.00 for yourself, $2500.00 for your husband and $2500.00 for each of your dependent children (foster children excluded of course) then you were subsidized too.

A single person would have to realize a taxable income (after write offs and personal exemptions) of $57,000 before they would pay their full share of $2500.00

A married couple would have to realize a taxable income (after write offs and personal/dependent exemptions) of $112,000 before they would pay their full share of $5000.00

Of course once you begin to include dependents you would have to earn a considerable amount more before you would begin to reach a threshold that includes your child’s fair share.

An individual realizing an adjusted taxable income of $150,000.00 will pay approx $12,000. (almost 5 X his share) $200,000.00 filers (adjusted) will pay approx, $16,250.00 (6.5 X his share). These are the people who are subsidizing the rest of us.

A single filer realizing a cool MILLION (adjusted) will pay approximately $90,000.00 . That is 36 X his fair share!!

P.S. I did a lot of rounding in approximating the above figures. They are not exact by any means but they are close enough to illustrate how main stream taxpayers are “subsidized” through the escalating % of taxes paid by higher earners.

Note: (adjusted) means after the filer has claimed all his/her write offs, exemptions and standard deductions.

Cindy and the usual suspects: -Now can you “round out” and estimate what would be due in taxes from the multi-millionare-then billionare “people corporations” In California sheltering their money because they have lobbyists who made sweet deals for them and high dig tax evasion specialists in Washington finding safe havens for their profits that go un touched??? The Mitt Romneys with 12,000,000 mansion remodels in la Jolla CA for their 2nd or 3rd getaway pad…Energy/Power Corps, Big Banking -Big Ag and large scale Developers…

I think the middle class will succeed in raising revenues unless the lobbyists are successful in spinning their own reality as usual-GO out and VOTE PEOPLE!


O.T. ? If you mean the cyber meaning of O.T.Josixpack isn’t O.T..

And Jo, you are right. If the Occupiers want to change things then one of the most important things they could do would be to get more people registered to vote.

I don’t have much faith in voting anymore. Since the black box systems became available, I think many election outcomes have been frauded.

An interesting article:

I’ll not vote to give the UC system more.

A good article disseminated by a reputable news agency. Thanks for the link. I heard on the news the University is investigating the pepper-spraying of the Davis protesters, and the UC Davis President (?) might get canned for approving the forceful removal of peaceful protestors. At least that’s what I remember from the Democracy Now news comment.