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Measures A and B landslide wins

August 31, 2011

The contentious battle over binding arbitration and benefits between San Luis Obispo city and its safety workers has ended with a landslide victory for the City Council.

A preliminary count of ballots showed that both Measure A and B passed with more than 70 percent of voters in favor.

Measure A allows the City Council to change employee retirement benefits without seeking voter approval. Measure B ends binding arbitration –  safety worker’s unions can no longer bring in a third party negotiator if labor talks are at an impasse.

“The working men and women of the San Luis Obispo City Police and Fire Association are grateful that the special election called by the San Luis Obispo City Council has concluded. While we are disappointed with the results of the election we are grateful that this divisive campaign is now behind us and that we can return all of our focus to providing the best public safety possible to the citizens of San Luis Obispo.

“It is important to note that this special election was brought to you by the members of the San Luis Obispo City Council and that throughout the campaign we remained dedicated to our jobs and committed to providing exemplary public safety,” said Erik Baskin, president of the San Luis Obispo Firefighters Association.


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Now all you employees on the government dole, that wasn’t so bad was it? All that crying and whining, like a 3 year old going in for a booster shot at the Doctors. It’s all over now and you can have a lollipop on the way out.


Of course government employees, understand that this is just the beginning. The reality is that the pain is going to be a lot more than just giving up your scheduled pay raises and binding arbitration rights. The reality is that CA is still on the verge of bankruptcy because the tax revenues aren’t coming in anywhere close to what the legislature prayed for (but knew was only a prayer). The reality is that all CA governments are heading for real cuts rather than just no increases.


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In my twisted mind, I hear the government employee say, “What? I can’t make more and more, while punishing the private sector and bashing big, evil business? No wonder I couldn’t get a job in the private sector with my degree in ”


(ok, that was mean, but I am still not a happy tax-payer)


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I’m a County employee; I agree all Public employees (Federal, State, County, local) should take a cut in pay.

If there were no exceptions, the cut would be minimal to offset deficits.

ALL should share the pain.

Joe


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I see no reason that public employees should be immune to the economic issues that the rest of us are forced to endure.


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A user account disabled remarks and replies deleted


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The last paragraph of the story should read:


“People will die,” said Erik Baskin, president of the San Luis Obispo Firefighters Association.


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I just want to know, now that we have done this, can we go after county and city employees next?


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I sure hope that this leads to that, everyman. One can only hope.


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Yes, cut every public (Federal, State, County, local) employee’s salary. It would be a small percentage cut as long as there were no exceptions. We can thank the union leaders for blocking this simple of a plan.

Oh, by the way, it wasn’t questioned much: why should police and firemen make the same as those in Southern Ca? Do they face the same dangers and frequency of their need as, let’s say, those in Compton, Inglewood, east L.A.?

Finally, the scare tactics used by the “No” campaign didn’t work!


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Thank you Scott Cramer, Ryan Mason, Rob Farino and Eric Baskin!


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For those who remember, this was not an issue that the City Council got behind right away… well, one member did from the beginning. This is an issue central to taxpayers and I hope the city council got the message.


However, I am sure we will now see the ax fall … but surprisingly, we will see the taxpayer asked to pay for more. However, this time the issue will be to give $300,000 to set aside for ‘open space’, unsustainable non profits and a big fat bonus to administrators. I wouldn’t be surprised if they try to sneak a raise for the city council.


To those on the city council, you have more tools to do your job … but the voters are watching.


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Typical thoughtless extreme negativity from Freberg, who is now campaigning AGAINST “open space”. Maybe he doesn’t realize that open space promotes healthier communities, decreasing crime and mental illness and making life more beautiful and refreshing in general. Some people are simply too narrow min ded, arrogant and selfish to appreciate the value and preciousness of such things.


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WOW! It does all THAT?!


If that’s the case, we should be living in Shangri-La already!


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I am living in Shangri-la. Aren’t you? I guess it may be a matter of the company one keeps.


It’s true that so many people, like Freberg, simply do not appreciate their blessings.


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Thoughtless extreme negativity? Many of us think of Freberg’s comments as measured and pragmatic. He has a grasp on economics.


Campaigning against open space?. He made a parallel observation,…. lighten up!


Your vindictive and uncalled for labels are obviously all you’re left with.


Pity.


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Many? How many? Grasp on economics? Are you serious? Its more like he’s got a fear-grip grasp on his own wallet and to hell with everyone else. Measured and pragmatic? More like extreme and lame.


And, sorry, I’m not going to join your “pity” party.


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Thank you, Rob Farino. None of this would be possible without your help.


How’s that boycott thang workin’ out for ya?


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*zing!*


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Unlike Mr. Farino, Mr. Baskin understands how to release an appropriate statement.


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As usual with a hot button issue on CCN we had a lot of naysayers come here and tell all of us posters that we don’t know what we are talking about and we are in the minority. Well as most of the time, time has proven the naysayers wrong. And with a three quarter passing margin, I would say by quite a bit!!! Now I wonder if they will do as usual and not have the courage to come back and post after the fact.


As Jan Marx said in a statement, this isn’t disrespect for the firefighters and police. I agree. This is just the reality that with a state at 12% unemployement, sales tax and properity tax revenue coming in going down (which is what pays the bills) and the state is going broke, the unions have to wake up and tighten their belt, just like the rest of us have been doing for the last three years.


You may not get cost of living increases, well guys welcome to most peoples realities!!! There are many in the private sector that haven’t had a raise in a few years!!!!! So you can make sacrifices just like everyone else.


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“As Jan Marx said in a statement, this isn’t disrespect for the firefighters and police.” Bullsh*t. Jan Marx is a tool; I’ll wager that everyone who voted for measures A & B would vote to have Jan Marx removed from office tomorrow if offered the chance. The sad reality here is that instead of being able to “hold the line” on employee benefits and wages and bring our city’s finances into more of a balance, my bet is that sometime in the near future those in management will secretly negotiate with the city council in a closed door session to make sure that their pensions are not reduced or possibly even increased since the city will apparently save some monies by reducing the wages of new hires, reduce the pension costs for new hires (a two-tiered approach, not really a bad idea) but most concerning to me is the possibility of reduced protection in the form of letting go of some of our police officers and fire protection personal.

The statement: ” … the unions have to wake up and tighten their belt, just like the rest of us have been doing for the last three years.” is, IMO, an attempt to justify the watering down of the middle class, a “class war” that the upper ten percent in our society have been waging for the last thirty years. Public workers used to make less than those in private industry, bargaining for better pensions and benefits instead of focusing on higher wages, but as the influence of unions diminished over the years and real wage growth for workers has not only stagnated but actually gone backwards, the public workers simply became the latest target. Instead of bringing them down to the level of those of us in private industry that have seen wages fall, benefits cut, and pensions reduced or eliminated, why haven’t we tried to bring everyone else back up to where we were before the attacks on unions began back during the Reagan years? Because those with the money have controlled the agenda, controlled the media, and most importantly, influenced the politicians to the point of absurdity. “Raise taxes on the rich? You’ve got to be joking; those are the ones that create the jobs!” To which I say, where are those jobs that they should have been creating with the lower tax bills they have enjoyed since 2001? It is all about protectionism for the wealthy, and the public workers are in the cross-hairs of those that want to make sure that government cannot do its job so those services can be privatized and further enhance the wealth of those prepared to make a bundle doing what should be government services. Please don’t gloat with this latest “victory”, it is just another step down the path of leading the US into a third world nation status.


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I think you’re missing an important aspect of this, bob. One thing is: true that public employees (government employees) used to make LESS than private sector. That was because government work was notorious for hiring those “who couldn’t make it” in the private sector. Schoolteacher was a housewife profession – I know, in 2011 lingo, that’s sexism, but the past IS the past, and the vast majority of schoolteachers, historically, were housewives and mothers (and God bless them for their work), and this was back when having a second income was gravy, and not necessity.


Over the years, much like the rejects that we keep electing, they do less and less for more and more. Now, many kids in college are aiming towards government work. What the F?! Who in their right mind 20, 30 or 50 years ago would want to go into government work? Today, it’s the golden ring! Of course this cannot last and will collapse and bring destruction with it, but that’s where we’re going if we’re not careful.


Unions were necessary when there were little or no LAWS protecting workers. Today, our litigious society is so sue-happy, the legal system will provide more protection for workers than unions ever will. Unions are just yet another fiefdom of some elite group lying to the plebs in the tiers below.


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“Unions were necessary when there were little or no LAWS protecting workers.” Okay, that is your opinion, mine is that unions are still valuable in that in those few places where union representation is still present, usually the employees have the benefit of a contract that the employer has signed, promising to follow and abide by. Without union representation, employees are totally at the mercy of their employer, down to the smallest detail. Would it really be enjoyable to have your superior tell you that you cannot go to the bathroom without their permission? To have an employer be able to tell you that you went thirty seconds over your ten minute break so they are going to dock you for a quarter of an hour’s pay may not happen to very many, but it does happen in non-union shops. Unions still have a place in our society.


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Wow, that was a 75% for, 25% against (rounded for convenience) result so far (in PDF) for both measures… guess it’s not the big unions’ year after all.


People have to realize two things: 1) You are NOT irreplaceable, and 2) Someone else is always ready to step in and take over. Often at less pay.


It sucks, but welcome to the global economy. Welcome to the private sector.


Hope I don’t die now.


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Of course, having just over 10,000 votes tallied is nothing to be proud of, SLO!


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Welcome to the private sector? Seriously r0y??? And as far as your statement “hope I don’t die now…” if you do place a 911 call, the same firefighters you are disrespecting will be at your door ready to help you, because that’s what they do.


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The “welcome to the private sector” was more akin to “this is how the other 75% have to live…”


…the “hope I don’t die” was a poke at Erik Baskin, president of the San Luis Obispo Firefighters Association.


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Yes, I got all your “pokes”…perhaps now is the time in your life to leave the private sector, enroll in one the fire academies in the State, train, drill, work for no benefits and barely minimum wage, until you land a salary position, hopefully not in Compton, and become one of the 25% (I don’t know if your percentages are correct) that roll out into an unknown emergency. Sometimes it’s to clean up vomit, sometimes it’s to administer CPR while the victim is dying in front of their loved ones. It’s all good…


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Guess what? Mothers and Janitors clean up vomit too. Lots of people are CPR trained. You should see some of the crap hotel maids have to deal with. These are not special skills. I’m sorry that the fire academies are all so militarized now, but even so, they are 3 days a week (3 hours for 2 days and 8 hours on Saturday), 2 semesters. THAT’S IT! And then they think they are so well trained and qualified that they should make more than someone with a PhD is making.


We ALL have to go through the period of our careers where we work for squat, get treated like crap, and often get no benefits. Even when we’re professionals, sometimes we get no benefits. What a bunch of egotistical jerks to think that they are somehow entitled to that money because of what they “go through.” Boo hoo, try the real world sometime, it’s a HELL of a lot more difficult.


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Fathers clean up vomit (and diahrrea) too! From someone who was cleaned up many a pile….


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“…they are 3 days a week (3 hours for 2 days and 8 hours on Saturday), 2 semesters…”


So their entire training is 14 hours/week for a year with the summer off? THAT’S the vaunted training I have heard so much about? Really? And they use this to justify their ridiculous pay and benefits? Scary.


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How about this. Why don’t you go to college? If you choose Cal Poly just about any degree will take 5 years of your life. Many will take 6. And guess what? You won’t get paid at all! You have to pay them to attend!


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Andy, as a retired fire captain I suggest you give it up. I think the general population is well aware of what we do and they don’t have to be continually reminded of it. Yes, there are some tough calls but they’re not so tough that many guys quit the job before they retire. The taxpayer foots the bill for us going on those tough calls. That’s what we get paid to do.


Also, I didn’t care for your disparaging comment about Compton. It was probably before your time but my Strike Team was assigned to Compton during the 1992 riots. I fought fire alongside those guys from Compton FD and I was proud to do it. Those guys probably saw more structure fires in two days than you’ll see in your whole career. And I didn’t hear one of them complain about their job. Once again, it’s what we get paid to do.


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oldbrown…..time for you to shut up too. Nobody wants to hear from an old, tired washed up captain who claims to know it all. I would guess most of the firefighters who worked under you have absolutely no respect for you.


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LOL…slojo I though you would be gone by now. What are you trying to achieve at this point by shooting off your mouth (or keyboard)? You never did come out and say what your dog was in this fight…at least the FF’s that wrote the opinion letters had the courage to put their name with their grievance. What’s your deal? Oh yeah, don’t come back with “I am just a concerned SLO citizen”…no one is buying that.


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What does it matter who I am?


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I am just curious that is all…you have very strong sentiments on this issue and I was just wondering if you were affected directly (meaning a spouse, sibling, parent, etc.,) by the vote and the now likely benefit/pay reductions. But, you are correct, it doesn’t matter who you are, you are entitled to your point of view. Peace…


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I doubt that anyone really cares who you are but they are curious about what you do for a living. You certainly sound like you’ve got a lot of skin in this game as slocorruptionhater so correctly pointed out.


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“What does it matter who I am?”


I’ll tell you: Because defining your relationship to the issue differentiates you from a forum troll.


You’ve single-handedly posted over 10% of the comments on this article; you have a very strong (and often acerbic) position. These both lead any reasonable person to believe you have a high personal stake in this issue.


If you wish your numerous comments to carry credibility (from authority of experience, direct knowledge, etc.), then it is incumbent upon you to describe your relationship to, source of knowledge, or interest in this issue.


Without information that establishes your experience, interest or credibility, your strong views are far more likely to appear as henpecking than informed.


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Slojo,


You sound pretty angry. I’ve never claimed I know it all. As a matter of fact, I was still learning on the day I retired. Learning is an on-going process in the fire service. As for your “guess”, I worked for a large dept. and had dozens of different guys on my crews over the years. Many went on to be promoted to Captain and above and many still stay in touch via email or visits to my home. The majority of those guys were excellent FF’s, a few were just so-so and one or two were guys just like you who never fit in, always complained and were usually encouraged by the guys at the station to transfer somewhere else. Preferably another Battalion many miles away.


The only thing I was trying to point out in my previous comments is the fact that being a firefighter in California is a pretty good job. The pay is good, the working schedule is good and the benefits are good. Although you claim you’re not a FF, I suspect you are and a young and mouthy one at that. Do you yap from the jump seat all the way to a call?


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OMG. You are one of those captains that guys hate to work for. A captain who thinks he has so much power that he can control what his firefighters do off duty. You are a joke and a joke to those who had to work for you. I hear firefighters talk about captains like you all the time.


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I disagree, troubled-angry-young-man. Oldbrown is the only FF who has posted that has demonstrated integrity, credibility and humility. If I were a FF, I would be honored to have him as my chief.


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@kidholm…or a “troubled-angry-young-WOMAN”…OMG


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@slocorruptionhater: Good point! Never assume about these things!


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slojo, Quit being a hot head.


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If you hear FF’s talk about captains “all the time” it sure sounds like you’re married to one or you’re one yourself. If you are a FF it sounds like you’ve got nothing better to do than listen to others gossip about their supervisor.


As for controlling off-duty behavior, station captains don’t have that kind of authority but maybe if they did there would be fewer loose cannons like you in the fire service.


Just curious, but do you not understand the difference in a thumbs up or a thumbs down? That’s sort of a clue to how well you’re doing with your poorly thought out comments.


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Slojo, you’re a punk. Go play with your friends and leave reputable posters alone. Oldbrown makes sense and has gained much respect on this board.


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