Man shoots and seriously injures estranged wife

December 2, 2012

William Roger Forgey

Grover Beach Police are searching for a man who allegedly shot his estranged wife on Saturday around 9 p.m.

William Roger Forgey, 46, of Roseville shot his wife at a home on the 800 block of Mentone Avenue and then fled the scene. While running eastbound on Mentone Avenue, he shot at a neighbor who was not injured.

Emergency personnel transported Forgery’s wife to Sierra Vista Regional Medical Center where she is being treated for serious injuries.

Police believe Forgey is driving a silver 2004 Toyota 4 Runner with a California license plate 5DVW739. He has ties to the Sacramento area.


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Yet another false-equivalency argument: cars-vs-gun fatalities.

I agree that cars are potentially more dangerous than guns, but using “accident” figures for autos, versus “suicide & homicide” figures for guns, does not create an equivalency. Beyond that, the comparison can’t be done on any level, because the needs for driving to not equate to the needs for shooting a gun, and the time actually spent firing a gun is minuscule compared to time spent driving. Ownership numbers are irrelevant.

Every time I get in my car, I could potentially hurt someone, because I’m controlling a 4,000# projectile that has about a 15 square feet impact area on either end. It takes a considerable amount of skill and attention to keep from hitting anything, but as a society we’ve committed untold amounts of talent, money, resources and land area to reducing the potential for loss of property and life due to the operation of motor vehicles. Yet it still happens, and we continue to try to make it safer.

Can the same be said for guns? Most owners use a gun primarily for sport or protection. I certainly don’t use my car for that. I’ll try to find some equivalency here, something the gun lobby has pretended to do but never taken seriously.

What other items might I use for protection? A golf club, baseball bat or pickaxe handle comes to mind. I can keep that in my car or next to my bed, it can be used for defense, it may be a deterrent, and it can cause great bodily injury. I can also use these items for recreation, which is equivalent to target practice with a gun, equivalent in a sense to hunting, even.

Are you willing to guess how many people die as a result of suicide using a golf club? How about homicide with a baseball bat? Accident with an axe handle?

If you’re willing to do the work it takes to create an argument based on equivalency (which no one in the gun community has ever done to date) then I’m quite willing to hear it. Until then, your argument is 100% EMOTIONAL (“they’re taking my guns”) and NOT LOGICAL.

The only problem with your argument is that guns are much more effective in protection and hunting than a golf club, baseball bat or pic axe.

There is no “equivalent” to guns- that is why these 12th century inventions are still being used today.

The 12 year old girl from Oklahoma who shot a home invader in October would not have had such luck with any of the fore-mentioned “weapons.”

“Arms” as seen by the founders would include everything in your list and quite a bit more, but that is a whole ‘nother discussion.

The victim in this crime only had 1 avenue by which she may have escaped unharmed: had she been armed and could have stopped her assailant before he shot her. Plain and simple terms. Bringing a “…golf club, baseball bat or pickaxe handle…” would have been ineffective

Equivalence? Heavens no. I am asserting that cars are MUCH more dangerous and likely to cause harm or death compared to a firearm. However, they are the same in as much as they are both inanimate objects that are completely useless without human interaction.

i fully support the right to own a personal gun. But I am wlse enough to know that having one for protection rarely works out the way that it does on TV or in the imaginations of the gun nuts. Having a gun can give someone a false sense of security and is much more likely to lead to getting yourself or a family member shot by it, rather than saving yourself from a criminal.

It is gun owners who are so arrogant and deluded and don’r appreciate the dangers who we should be most concerned about.

For instance, someone here posted about having easy access to a gun whenever she would open the door to someone who is “suspicious.”. Well, why open the door at all if you are concerned enough to need a gun?

In one-on-one situation, pulling a gun on someone who has a gun is dangerous and rarely goes well for the would-be defender, unlike in the movies or TV. Better to avoid the situation is what any sane firearms defense expert would tell you.

With that said, I once again want to make it clear that I support the right to own firearms. By the way, President Obama is on my side on that.

“…I support the right to own firearms…”.

I am hoping that you are wise enough to realize that your ‘support’ covers only 1/2 of our civil rights that are enumerated in the second amendment, correct? ‘Bear’ is the other 1/2.

I am also really hoping that my fellow posters here realize that the Bill of Rights is not the SOURCE of our civil rights. The Bill of Rights is the FIREWALL against government intrusion into our fundamental individual civil rights. In other words, every person on earth is created with exactly the same set of civil rights. Some places trample those rights, some places tolerate some of those rights, and some places like to pretend that they are protecting those rights.

The Second Amendment was written to protect citizens against government intrusion into the individual’s civil rights to Keep and Bear arms for the purpose of self defense. I originally posted that I believed that had the woman been armed, there could very likely have been a different outcome to the situation.

Again I ask for references to the statements that you are making WiseGuy. Please direct me to the peer reviewed university study that supports your assertions. Here are a few that you can review until then:

Stephen G. Bronars, University of Texas, and John R. Lott, Jr., Criminal Deterrence, Geographic Spillovers, and Right-to-Carry Concealed Handguns, American Economic Review, May 1998

Carlisle E. Moody, College of William and Mary, and Thomas B. Marvell, Justec Research, ‘The Debate on Shall-Issue Laws’, Econ Journal Watch, 2008

Eric Helland, Claremont-McKenna College and Alexander Tabarrok, George Mason University, “Using Placebo Laws to Test ‘More Guns, Less Crime’,” The B.E. Journal of Economic Analysis & Policy, 2008

Florenz Plassmann, State University of New York at Binghamton, and John Whitley, University of Adelaide, ‘Confirming “More Guns, Less Crime”‘, Stanford Law Review, 2003

Get the idea of the type and quality of studies that I am talking about? Please cite your sources.

Mary, My gun is loaded and unlocked at all times. Unless someone is visiting me with children, I always have it in an area where I can easily access it. No I do not answer the door with the gun close at hand but if someone knocked who I thought was suspicious, I can guarantee that I would arrange it’s quick access before I opened the door. All it would take is for me to say, “just a minute” and I would be back in a minute to open the door if I thought opening the door might be warranted. In short, I agree with chopruzul.

Hi Cindy. Based on what you wrote, and based on national statistics, it is MUCH more likely that your gun will end up shooting you or some innocent person , rather than a criminal.

And, I imagine, like most people who get shot by their own guns or let their gun get into other people’s hands, you probably think that would never happen with you or your gun.

Can you cite your source for “…national statistics…”? Peer reviewed we would hope?

The only way that I will come to harm by my own firearm is if the bad guy beats me with it. Then, it will only be because there were too many bad guys and I ran out of ammo.

It’s sad what TV shows do to some people’s imaginations, leading those people to believe life is the way it is shown on cop shows and westerns.

It is arrogant gun owners with attitudes like Choprzrul, who are the most likely to get hurt or get other, innocent people, hurt with their gun.

What is sad is people actively working to oppress the free exercise of civil rights by law abiding citizens. I asked for a citation of the statistics you presented and you came back with anti-civil-rights blather.

Here are some staggering national statistics based on 5.8 million motor vehicle crashes reported in the 2008 Traffic Safety Annual Assessment by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration:

37,261 total people killed

14,587 killed in passenger car accidents

10,764 killed in light truck crashes

5,290 motorcycle deaths

4,378 pedestrians killed

717 pedalcyclist deaths – such as bicycles

In addition to those whose lives were extinguished by traffic accidents in 2008, another 2.35 million people were injured in vehicle crashes:

1.3 million drivers or occupants of passenger cars

768,000 drivers or passengers in light trucks

23,000 in large truck crashes

96,000 motorcyclists

69,000 pedestrians

52,000 pedalcyclists

In the U.S. for 2006, there were 30,896 deaths from firearms, distributed as follows by mode of death: Suicide 16,883; Homicide 12,791; Accident 642; Legal Intervention 360; Undetermined 220.

A truly ‘WiseGuy’ would be advocating for the elimination of cars, they are more dangerous than guns.

Lemme fix this for you…. Its sad what some TV shows and politicians try to beat into some peoples imagination, leading those people to believe life will be like it was in Demolition man per snipes escape. A utopia of sorts without crime or vulgar language,where all is fair. An existence ruled by kinder gentler leaders who think they can stop deranged gang bangers and thugs from obtaining guns, but in reality they’ve disarmed law abiding citizens. These “haters” of human rights really believe some day we’ll all be living in a dream world where everybody makes the same wage and kisses each other good night.

I can’t imagine anyone living that way, Cindy. To me, living in a state of siege is not living.

I beg your pardon? There is a gun in my house, so what? Do you think it can get up and do something all by itself?

What I can’t imagine is living in a home with a large “pitch black” back yard in the evening with no neighbors behind me and plenty of windows that are accessible from the ground level while I am upstairs in my family room or asleep without some sort of reliable protection.

Tell that to the 12 year old girl in Oklahoma who shot her home’s intruder last month. These kind of stories are very prevalent, but you won’t hear about them from those who want to remove the right to bear arms.

A country of armed citizens is better able to protect itself from foreign attack- just imagine what would have happened during WWII off the coast of California if ranchers and citizens were not armed themselves.

So, MaryMalone, if I have 3 fire extinguishers in my house and garage, does that mean I am living in a state of siege??? Are you asserting that I am living in constant fear of a house fire? Really?

In 1988, while stationed in Germany, I had an old E-7 that always hammered home the 6 ‘Ps’: Prior Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance. I am an optimist that is always looking for the good in my fellow man. However, I am not delusional believing that I am invulnerable to harm. I fully understand that people can be mean, ugly, and down right evil. I also fully understand that fate/circumstances can bring me face to face with one of those people at any given second of my day. Anyone who doesn’t prepare for that meeting is downright negligent. Prepare for the worst and hope for the best.

My thoughts and prayers go out to this woman and her family.

Had she been well armed and well trained, this most likely would have ended very differently.

Unless she carries her weapon with her 24/7, the chances are the gun was not in her hand when the husband showed up deranged enough to try to kill her.

The meme about the “if she was well armed and well trained” just doesn’t wash in the face of reality.

I am working at my computer, and my firearm is locked up in a bureau drawer in another room. If someone entered my home with intent to harm me, I would not have my gun on my person and, the chances are, I would not be able to get to it in time.

So, unless you are going to carry a firearm when you answer the door for trick-or-treaters, the idea that a firearm can protect you from someone who wants to kill you is very conditional.

You seem to have a firm grasp on “Keep”.

You have also very effectively illustrated just how very important “Bear” is to our civil rights.

Unlike you, When I get home I slip on my IWB rig and arm myself.

An hour ago I learned that this case is much closer to me than what I like. The fugitive is still in our area and actively stalking his children & mother-in-law.

Anyone in SLO county is at risk. Walking. Driving. Sitting at home. As long as he is at large, we have zero idea where he is going to turn up next and we have no idea what extremes he will go to . He is armed and dangerous. If you aren’t armed, your chances of becoming a victim increase exponentially.

First let me state that anyone who has read my posts in past, can tell I have no problem with gun ownership.

Second reading your first post o.k. I see your point but this post??? REALLY??? I am sitting at home this evening and am no more worried than any other evening. I bet I have better odds of winning the powerball that just past, than this guy showing up at my front door. This was and is not random. The guy had an intended victim. You should have stopped at your first posting.

Oh and yes he shot at neighbor but that was in area of his victim. Again not worried in the least.

Understand this: the perp’s phone was triangulated to within 150 yds of my home this afternoon. I had to get the shift commander’s permission to enter my own driveway upon returning home. Turns out, a home in our neighborhood had the children and mother in law staying at it. The police escorted the family away from here. The point is, the guy is very dangerous and was very close to my home. Now the family has been moved and nobody has any idea where the perp is at.

While your powerball odds may be correct, my family and I could have been minutes from a high risk situation.

So, go ahead and settle in with your blinders. I’m going to keep my eyes wide open.

When you stated closer than you would like, I thought you were talking about in the county in general, seeing as your comment to anyone in the county. Yea at 150 yards I would have a different opinion. BUT to the best of my knowledge no person related lives in my area (Paso) and with this being in Grover my risk to yours is two different situations.

So yes a gun might be an appropreiate responce and or just staying inside till they catch him.

Again though I don’t live my life in fear. That my friend isn’t a life at all. An no, no blinders. I don’t put myself in danger but when it’s your time to go, go hide under that bed. You won’t change anything. When it is your time, it’s your time and no gun or whatever will stop that.

Good post. Every second lived in fear is a second of life denied. Living in fear in the vast majority of situations is a choice. Even though we’ve been socially conditioned to live in fear, we can choose not to for the most part.

That being said, in immediate, real circumstances, fear is a great motivator, if you don’t let it overcome you.

Your original “my thoughts are with the family” type post in no way indicated that your situation was quite different than that of most other people in the world. So the tag-on “if she would have been armed” type of statement, IMO, demonstrated a paranoid siege mentality with which I don’t agree. Indeed, I find such a belief to be productive of nothing but amping up even more paranoia and violence.

Just my opinion, your mileage may vary.

Unlike you, When I get home I slip on my IWB rig and arm myself

A little something like this ?

IWB: INSIDE the waist band.

Your picture depicts OUTSIDE of the waist band.

So, no, it’s not something like that. It is more like this:,ProductName

Okay, you and Cindy are creeping me out, and I am someone who doesn’t easily get creeped out.

I was married for years to a Vietnam vet with PTSD off the charts before they even told us there was something like PTSD. To say he was paranoid at baseline is a vast understatement.

But when he started doing bucket-fulls of cocaine at a time, and drinking huge amounts of alcohol, he was extremely paranoid.

So I’ve been creeped out by one of the best. The statements by you and Cindy creep me out.

So, law abiding citizens exercising their fundamental individual civil rights creeps you out??? THAT is creepy.